rigger 47 Posted September 4, 2010 Share Posted September 4, 2010 A question for the multihullers - attaching bridle to anchor warp Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 2:03 pm Post subject: A question for the multihullers I was asked this today by another party. How do you attach your bridle to the anchor warp? And then how do you attach two warps if you want to put out a second anchor? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- voom Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 3:20 pm Bridle attaches to outer end of front beam with loop spliced/tied in centre, anchor at pre set depth is attached with good anchor knot its all chucked in the piss - from there on its a bit like a keel boat. Usually a second anchor is deployed to stop swinging, pull the bow one way or another or help avoid dragging etc. I have found it is easier to run the second anchor to somehwere else on the boat to make it easier to retreive and keep the main anchor easy to get to. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 3:23 pm What's an anchor knot? His query was how to attach two warps to one bridle, I take it you simply don't?? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- voom Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 3:28 pm If the second anchor is out as a safety because of extreme conditions I think I would want it tied to a completly different piece of structure. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Knot Me Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 5:49 pm This one is for a mooring but similar for anchoring can be used. The hook is different or some use snap shackles, chain shackles and the like. Some just tie a knot and some use that monster hook and just wrap the warp around it a few times. mor bridal.JPG -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:19 am Got the idea, next question is what knot, would a rollijng hitch be good enough ,or is there some magic one I don't know about? (Thought KM didn't like knots in rope?) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PaulR Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:35 am Post subject: Anchor Bend http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchor_bend http://www.animatedknots.com/anchor/ind ... dknots.com There you go Squid. That should get your tentacles in a tangle -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PaulR Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:37 am The magic of the knot is the passing through the ropes round turn on the ring, which stops both the rope slipping, chaffe and as load come on, the knot hardens. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:40 am Some people have too much time, but that is attaching rope to anchor, I want attaching rope (bridle) to anchor warp (rope or chain). KM said just wrap the rope around the hook, but I can't see that holding. Failing anything else I would go with a rolling hitch or even a camel hitch, but wondered if the multi boys knew of something better. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PaulR Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:48 am Take the warp to one bow & cleat off. Put a snatch block on warp & lead to other hull & take up until the warp is pulled to amidships, or where ever you want if you want a set a bias to the wind. Infinately adjustable and you can stll let out or take up warp as you wish to, should wind or tide change etc. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:02 am OK I Like that one -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim C Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:22 am On Pulse I used to use a rolling hitch onto the anchor rode for the bridle. I have to say I do that very rarely now. I use two anchors a lot; If it is windy both out the front spaced apart. I just like the security of two completely different systems holding me in place. One is a Guardian (alloy Danforth type), and the other a Delta, both on 15m chain. One always holds if the other doesn't on a tricky sea bed. When drying out I always use one opposite the other to prevent the boat drying out on one anchor. Waking up with an anchor between the hulls (I've done this only once!) is a scary wake up of what could happen. Also keeps the boat's position in case of NE to SW midnight change... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:41 am Tim, do both rodes attach directly to the boat i.e. no bridle, does the boat lie comfortably like that? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Fusion Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:43 am Not sure if this would be an option KM could advise. Given that a rope to chain splice is stronger than the rope. You could splice 4 links of Chain every 10 meters on your rode and use a snubber hook on the chain? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- fng Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:57 am heres a reasonable cruising set up 08cruisesep_067(2).jpg -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- fng Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:58 am more catmando roslyn bay 002.jpg -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- fng Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:59 am close up catmando roslyn bay 012.jpg -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- samin Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:00 pm My boat sails around something terrible on anchor, I finally have figured out how to kind of stop it, I use my main anchor (manson supreme) with a rope to tied to the rode near the surface (with a rolling hitch) to the float, then drop a second anchor (danforth) with no chain straight down off the bow just sitting on the bottom to stop the bow blowing around.... bit of a pain but works ok -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Knot Me Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:45 pm PaulR wrote: Take the warp to one bow & cleat off. Put a snatch block on warp & lead to other hull & take up until the warp is purlled to amidships, or where ever you want if you want a set a bias to the wind. Infinately adjustable and you can stll let out or take up warp as you wish to, should wind or tide change etc. Personally I very very much like this idea and is my first choice when I do things. You can use the same technique on monos as well to kink her off a bit to minimise wave or wind action. Fusion wrote: Not sure if this would be an option KM could advise. Given that a rope to chain splice is stronger than the rope. You could splice 4 links of Chain every 10 meters on your rode and use a snubber hook on the chain? I could advise you stop smoking that stuff (or at least pass it around ) Knot too sure how a splice can be stronger than the rope itself. But you are close, a good R2C splice will only weaken a rope as much as any other splice. But that idea, strangely, may have a bit of legs. I'm going to ponder that further. The problem with tieing knots is that if you put them under big load they can be fecking hard to get undone. Even supposed easy ones like rolling hitches and the like. I am knot a fan of tieing snubbers on. Sure it works but at the cost of having to cut your rope off sometimes and the time it takes to either untie or cut if you are in a panic. I like to be able to leave 'Right now BEFORE the feckwit 50ft Fizz nasty rolls over the top of me at 3am'. Also if the knot starts to slide it can generate a lot of fibre friction which leads to heat. Heat kills most ropes and can do so very fast. If, when, I have my next multi I'll be using what Paul said. Easy, cheap, massively adjustable and best of all works damn good. At a pinch you don't even need a block, a nice decent SS shackle will work. A block is better for longer term use though, less rope wear. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 7:15 am Paul's idea is also very suitable for a proa where the bridle arms would be different lengths. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ScottiE Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:12 am I use this on the GBE also - used to use a SS bow shackle as KM suggests but picked up a good reasonably priced snatch block with snap shackle (taped when used in this situation!). I reckon these must be one of the best multi-purpose blocks u could have on a boat of any description. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PaulR Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:24 am ScottiE wrote: . . . snatch block with snap shackle (taped when used in this situation!). I reckon these must be one of the best multi-purpose blocks u could have on a boat of any description. Yes indeed and get the largest sized one, preferably with what they call a "triunion" snap shackle. It has an flopping pivot action. Damm. That's the dearest one Yes your right, but the investment is worth it. You can use the same heavy duty bridle for: setting a sea anchor with a bias, heeling you over and controlling pulling direction if you go aground, towing or being towed at sea, lifting tackle to retrieve a person from the water, lifting motors out through hatchway, mooring along side a jetty in a heavy swell to act as a spring adjuster, and many other uses. The great advantage being the ability to open the block and fit over a rope without untying the said rope, and snap shutting immediately. I always carry about 4 spare large shackles with my offshore gear. I have used S/S shackles in the past but the pins should be siezed which then makes them not as easy nor quick to undo. The snatch block works everytime, and has the larger sheeve diameter that elimates the point tension that a shackle creates on your warp, that can cut through the warp, on that dark and stormy night -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:41 am A downside is that airlines are charging a bloody fortune for excess luggage now, and the gear you carry to do an offshore trip almost certainly gets you over their paltry limit. Coming back from Brisbane recently I removed my ( very heavy, with harness installed) Henri Lloyd gear from my bag and saved nearly $50 (boots another $10). I then donned said gear and walked to the plane, attracting some odd looks. On the plane I removed it and put it in the overhead, as I was wearing it, it wasn't luggage. One lady on the plane did ask if I had been to Antartica. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- MrWolf Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 9:10 am PaulR wrote: Take the warp to one bow & cleat off. Put a snatch block on warp & lead to other hull & take up until the warp is pulled to amidships, or where ever you want if you want a set a bias to the wind. Infinately adjustable and you can stll let out or take up warp as you wish to, should wind or tide change etc. Ok, I'll take the bait. i'm calling this maneouvre a bluff by Paul R. I can't see it working on a multihull, especially one that has either one bobstay (tri), or two in the case of cats. The advantage of the bridle, is that when you ease out the bridle and the anchor is only attached to the bridle then the whole thing is totally out in front of the boat and clear of the bobstay etc. It can also be slightly assymetric to keep the boat from circling. Pauls idea sounds excellent for some applications but not for anchoring a multihull with a bobstay (would surely work on a powercat). i can't see how you can do it other than setting up a bridle and tying the anchor rode to it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PaulR Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 9:42 am MrWolf wrote: PaulR wrote: Take the warp to one bow & cleat off. Put a snatch block on warp & lead to other hull & take up until the warp is pulled to amidships, or where ever you want if you want a set a bias to the wind. Infinately adjustable and you can stll let out or take up warp as you wish to, should wind or tide change etc. Ok, I'll take the bait. i'm calling this maneouvre a bluff by Paul R. I can't see it working on a multihull, especially one that has either one bobstay (tri), or two in the case of cats. The advantage of the bridle, is that when you ease out the bridle and the anchor is only attached to the bridle then the whole thing is totally out in front of the boat and clear of the bobstay etc. It can also be slightly assymetric to keep the boat from circling. Pauls idea sounds excellent for some applications but not for anchoring a multihull with a bobstay (would surely work on a powercat). i can't see how you can do it other than setting up a bridle and tying the anchor rode to it. STRIKE I've got one on the line. Sunday is my first opportunity for sea trials, racing Saturday. Do you have the equipment? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim C Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:16 am Crew.org.nz(a.k.a. Squid) wrote: Tim, do both rodes attach directly to the boat i.e. no bridle, does the boat lie comfortably like that? Yes both attach directly to the centreline at the fore beam. Maybe I've just got lazy, but the difference IMHO between having a bridle on and not is moot. Remember when anchoring a multi if you are in the wind you are not close enough to the beach! I regularly dry my boat out when onboard. One of the tricks is to get the rudders up at anchor; that's what multi's sail around at anchor. A little bit of centreboard can help. But in tidal stream a bit of rudder to hold 'course' into the stream is worthwhile. Believe me I've had the chance to try all sorts of things! I've done high speed 360˚ spins on my mooring at Sandspit, on a bridle, in streaming tide gusty wind situations. Perhaps 20 seconds for the complete turn! Head spinning as well as boat spinning. So read sentence three again... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Link to post Share on other sites
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