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Stephen Fry & Catholics


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#21 Priscilla II

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Posted 15 August 2018 - 07:04 PM

Pretty doubtful that the Catholic hierarchy will ever face up to the undeniable and irrefutable fact that some of their voluntary celibate employees are some of the most prevalent sexual predators.
Popeys recent defence of and then subsequent backflip over the Chilean Bishop shone a clear light on the arrogance and detachment that the Catholic hierarchy has in spades.
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#22 native

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Posted 17 August 2018 - 06:51 AM

This latest chapter in the catholic churches cover up of sexual abusers is unfortunately not the last we will hear about. Any organisation that claims celestial rights and power over children will attract this behaviour but there must be a place in hell (and quite a large, well populated one) for those who are given the trust of children only to abuse them in the most horrible way. If there is a definition of evil, I think this must be right up there and I thought the church was against evil doing? It seems so institutionalised in the church, not isolated,  everywhere you look you'll find it, here in NZ, Australia, from the Tuam nuns in Ireland to this latest episode in the US, its truly a multinational multicultural problem. How could a parent send their kids into the care of priests, nuns or brothers at least without wondering what could be going on.


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#23 wild violet

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Posted 17 August 2018 - 07:16 AM

I was backpacking through Ireland in the eightys,down in the republic there were very few young people they fled to england as fast as they could.I was asked to take the sister of a girl I met in oz to england,she was only 16 and her parents begged me to take her back with me.That was when the war was in full swing but the main reason was the catholic churchs massive dominance over peoples lives.Divorce was illegal so was contraception.Also at the time Dublin was a very third world city massive poverty no jobs dirt rats and smashed up cars quite a scary place for a 20 year old kiwi boy.I felt more nervious there than in Belfast.The church was rich as but the poor bloody people werent.
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#24 Priscilla II

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Posted 21 August 2018 - 07:41 AM

Not pleasant reading but on the eve of Popey checking in on his Irish flock he could show some contrition and at least make public the list of sex offenders in his crew.
https://www.bishop-accountability.org/
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#25 native

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Posted 26 August 2018 - 05:38 PM

800 babies chucked in a sewerage pit by nuns

 

https://www.nzherald...jectid=12113807

 

Are these people so blinded by their obedience to the church that they cannot see the banality of evil? 


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#26 Priscilla II

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Posted 26 August 2018 - 06:20 PM

Simple easy fix for resolving the temptation to fiddle with kiddies would have been to join the reformists and allow the Catholic clergy to have legal humpy pumpy.
It is a ecclesiastical opinion and not church dogma that keeps this appalling abuse reoccurring perpetually.
Popey could fix it in a flash but shows no real interest apart from blaming the past and promising change that will never arrive.
In 1544 the Catholic Church signed off on slavery being all good so there is yet another example that the church is doggy deep complicit in a lot of human misery and continues to be so today.
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#27 ScottiE

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Posted 27 August 2018 - 12:56 AM

Ah - I see the Catholic persecution continues here by Native and Priscilla II.   I did say previously that I'd respond to the outdated clip that was the beginning of this blog but I've just been too busy to really do it the justice I know you seek.  Instead I'll just respond to your posts from 15 August.  There's no point in me spending time going back further as I suspect that you both will just pivot your direction of attack tomorrow.  

 

1544?  Not sure what you are referring to here.  Can you be specific and cite an actual decree.  For reference, either side of your date, 1537 - Paul III, Sublimus Dei; 1591 - Gregory XIV. Cum Sicuti.  You'll be able to find English translations on the Vatican website - sing out if you can't and I'll help you out.

 

That's not to say that there weren't Catholics throughout history that engaged in Slavery - it would be ignorant to suggest that.  However to think their behaviour was somehow sanctioned by the Magisterium is wrong.  Dig hard enough and you'll be able to find information on some Jesuits who held slaves in America.  Similarly there are a number of individuals, who are Catholics, who are complicit in various forms human misery today, that I grant you.  However I hope you would also grant me the statement that there are many orders of magnitude more Catholics who work to alleviate human suffering  today.  That is after all part of what the Church proposes that we should all aspire to.

 

The Clergy Child and Adult Sex Abuse Scandal

 

So this is a massive area for which the whole Catholic Church rightly suffers significantly for, and will continue to do so for probably another generation or so.  What these men did was indefensible.  There's so much written about it throughout the world that no one here could ever do it adequate justice - least of all me.  However I do think that there are a number of statements in the posts above that I'd like to respond to in general terms and in one place.  I'm not going to respond to the notion that these horrific acts were perpetrated because of the Church's insistence on Priestly Celibacy - other than to say that is simply incorrect. If you really would like to know then I suggest you read "the John Jay Report" 2004.  That report was the American Catholic Church's own independently commissioned study into wtf happened.  It's quite representative of the major issues that the Church was faced with there, and is, and will be elsewhere in the world. What is new of course is the revelations of the actions of ex-Cardinal McCarrick.

 

You'll note the year of that publication is now 14 years ago.  The rest of the world is in various degrees taking a quite similar path.  What you will note from that report is that by the time of its publication clergy abuse had returned to almost nothing - changes long since made in the late 90's.  Almost nothing - because it would be foolish to suggest otherwise.  Reference to the Pennsylvania report as being "the latest" is inaccurate - my understanding is all but 2 of the cases were previously dealt with in the prior report in some way.  This is now state attorneys vying for political sway - there's going to be many more over the next decade from various states.

 

However, comments in the posts above clearly either ignore these facts or allude to something still occurring. If it’s the latter then I can only urge in the strongest terms that you should consider contacting the Police, and/or the National Office of Professional Standards, commissioned by the NZ Catholic Bishops, but run independently of them.

 

Spreading the notion that such abuse, and cover up, will continue in perpetually is not only manifestly incorrect, but also runs the risk of not providing confidence to those who actually do need real help in their lives to come forward.  They may not want help from the Catholic Church, that's fine, but they should at least have the confidence to contact the Police, who will deal with it, and put them in touch with support services.

 

The notions also that the Catholic Church, the Pope, etc have not owned up to this huge abhorance in its history is also manifestly incorrect and the evidence overwhelmingly supports this - if you choose to objectively look at it.  My fear however is that sexual abuse in the wider community, beyond the Catholic Church, will only get worse.  I really hope I'm wrong.

 

800 babies in a Septic Tank

This story is getting old now and it is just lazy, not to mention, bigoted reporting from our so called national newspaper.  Here's some alternative facts you might want to read. 

 

https://www.irishtim...story-1.1823393

 

https://www.catholic...-unwed-mothers/

 

 

 

Well that's me for a while.  Don't PM me - I won't answer. Let's keep this strictly public.  Don't expect timely replies either, I don't really spend any time here anymore.


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After a decade or so of Euphoria . . . it's time to go Ballistic!
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#28 Priscilla II

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Posted 27 August 2018 - 07:13 AM

Apologies Scott got my dates confused.
http://ldhi.library....and_the_portugu

https://www.irishtim...y-back-1.610881


http://www.ncregiste...ccarricks-abuse
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#29 native

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Posted 27 August 2018 - 08:28 AM

This discussion is not about how hard done the church is and playing the persecution card is cynical, its the bigotry and persecution of children and the vulnerable by the priests and nuns of the catholic church that's on the table. The church should be held to an infinitely higher standard morally and ethically that the rest of society but what we see is a systematic cover up that goes to the very top of the power structure. That is called corruption. You make a point that the good works of the church outweigh the bad, that in my view is a false dichotomy and in fact to argue that is to admit that its an organisation that sees itself beyond secular oversight. Your claim is essentially that because father brown helped to feed and clothe many orphans and runs the youth outreach centre, if he fiddled with a few kids on the side, just forget about because thats in the past and we dont do that anymore. Yeah....Nah.

The catholic church is not going away but at least its hypocrisy is on full display, not the least of it being a bunch of elderly virgin men adorned in heavy jewellery, prancing about in versace robes in their golden palaces dictating how the poor should live and what sexual activity you and I should engage in.
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#30 native

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Posted 29 August 2018 - 12:14 PM

but wait theres more.....

 

https://www.nzherald...jectid=12114773


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