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YNZ Race Regulations Cat1-Cat5; Anomalies and concerns


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#1 DrWatson

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Posted 27 February 2019 - 02:45 AM

Thought I'd start this for people to add to, then later we have all our gripes and concerns in one place so when the next revision is due...

 

 

19.04 NAVIGATION SYSTEMS

 

(d) Echo (Depth) Sounder

 

Required for all categories. Seriously? For a Cat 5 race you have to have an echo sounder? Seems a little over the top... how many mullet boats have a depth sounder? Given there're plenty of small boats that don't have wiring of any sort,... How many are going to have an echo sounder? What happened to having a lead line? 

 

 

20.0 ENGINEERING SYSTEM

 

20.1 Installation of a propulsion engine ... 

 

Read carefully this clause does not exclude the use of an outboard for Cat 3 or higher. And this seems to be backed up by Reg 20.13 on Outboards, which covers all categories (1 through 5).

 

However, Reg 20.13 also states 

 

"The outboard motor(s) must not be located near accommodation"

 

for all categories.

How is "near" defined? Because unless you have the outboard in a well, on a larger boat it's unlikely to meet the next part of the rule about being operated without leaning over the railing, and if you have it in a well, it's going to be near the accommodation if you have quarter berths (who doesn't?). And in a smaller boat, an outboard on the transom is also going to be "near" accommodation, simply because on a small yacht friggin EVERYTHING is near the accommodations! How is one supposed to use this rule?

 

 

23.0 CLASSIC YACHTS

 

Not really a gripe but more an anomaly given that NZ's fleet is not getting any younger, it appears that if you have a one-off (or two off) boat more than 50y old, you can't sail it offshore according to the Protected Objects Act 2006. So I guess all of those folk with boats from before '69 are screwed if they wanted to sail offshore...

 


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"Si Dieu n'existait pas, il faudrait l'inventer"

 


#2 Knot Me... maybe

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Posted 27 February 2019 - 10:55 AM

Who said a 'Echo sounder' has to be electronic? A lead line does the exact same thing.

I'd say as YNZ do expect electronic failures, as shown by them saying you have to have a back up of the back up of your GPS, they will be fine with a lead line instead.

 

Yes it is weird a echo sounder is Cat 5 but nothing else. That makes no sense.

 

Outboards are fine for all Categories BUT outboards can not be outboard for Cats 1 and 2 I'm told. The thing with these is they do not want people outside of the lifelines trying to fit, fix or start outboards, so if the OB is inside the lifelines they are fine, which is handy seeing more boats are swinging that way over built in power plants.

 

You have to remember the Regs are written by old guys whose boating hey days were a wee while ago so they will push older gear/techniques over newer if they have any doubt. That's probably quite wise but it does have a way of playing with the newer gear, uses of it and emerging 'best practice'.

 

That 23 - weird, bizarre and unknown by everyone I've spoken to this morning. Even more weirder when the NZ Government has given old classic classics to other countries.


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#3 Steve Pope

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Posted 27 February 2019 - 01:28 PM

Try buying an echo sounder today, they all seem to be called "fishfinders" and come with gps as well, but they don't display the depths well, small size numbers.  Full screen display not available as far as I can see..


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#4 splat

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Posted 27 February 2019 - 01:44 PM

Try buying an echo sounder today, they all seem to be called "fishfinders" and come with gps as well, but they don't display the depths well, small size numbers.  Full screen display not available as far as I can see..

ahhh most chartplotter/ fishfinder combos (MFDS) are readily customised to suit user preferences including very large digits for depth, COG, Temp, time DTD, DTW, cross track error etc. Trouble in NZ is that the trailer boat market dominates ( 4-8 metre fishers) and there is little specialised sailing orientated stuff other than B&G IMHO. If you want depth then you could simply get Garmin, Simrad/B&G or advansea or similar instrument package with large number/illluminated displays. There is no reason to suffer with shitty hard to read displays. Most new units will link via wifi to a suitable tablet or phone if vision is a problem.


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#5 ex Elly

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Posted 01 March 2019 - 11:31 AM

Lead lines got removed from the rules about 8 years ago. I was surprised there wasn't any outcry at the time.


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#6 Knot Me... maybe

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Posted 01 March 2019 - 12:26 PM

I do think the requirement for a echo sounder, how quaint they use terminology from the 1940's, for Cat 5 is a tad stupid. That means a Cat 5 boat has to install an electrical system to run the bloody thing.


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#7 YNZ

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Posted 03 March 2019 - 03:18 PM

If this thread can remain constructive and sensible, then it can provide some valuable feedback from this community, which we can feed into the review of the regulations. 


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#8 Steve Pope

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Posted 03 March 2019 - 04:08 PM

If this thread can remain constructive and sensible, then it can provide some valuable feedback from this community, which we can feed into the review of the regulations. 

Thanks YNZ, that is a positive move. Perhaps you could have an email link up with folk that can assist with rule changes and the possibility of unintended consequence and their impact that may have not been recognised by the rules committee.


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#9 John B

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Posted 05 March 2019 - 04:07 PM

Akarana was given to Australia a long time before the antiquities act began to be applied to classic boats. The catalyst for that was Iorangi being packed up for export at Orams back ooo  late '90s or early 2000's? She was met on the docks at  Sydney and a bond posted for her return. 

 I forget what the definition of a classic is now  but its more like 1949 than 1969.49 to 1970 might be the modern classics.


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#10 Sabre

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Posted 21 March 2019 - 08:58 PM

Could some/most of the contents of a liferaft be transferred to a grab bag? ie a Cat 1 grab bag rather than a Cat 1 liferaft? It would simplify and therefore reduce the servicing costs (which are rediculous) and give more affordable options for filling the grab bag with the appropriate gear for the intended use. It would also give users the opportunity to replace the food/water/batteries etc more often.

It is getting to the point where liferafts are becoming a disposable item for offshore sailing which really doesn’t fit in this age of reduce, re-use, recycle. YNZ, any thoughts on this?
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