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Loss of the sail training vessel Concordia


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#1 Island Time

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Posted 08 April 2019 - 08:26 PM

Some interesting reading here;

 

http://www.bst-tsb.g...3/m10f0003.html

 

How many of us know about squall curves??


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#2 Sabre

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 04:57 AM

Crikey that’s a detailed report. I learned a lot just from skin reading that.

Probably the biggest point for me is to keep your boat sealed up in unstable weather. Also keep your epirb contact details up to date as with so many false alerts these days the search can be delayed without some confirmation.

Hard to believe there were no casualties. The captain, 2/O and Bosun done bloody well to get everyone off safely.
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#3 Island Time

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 07:40 AM

Indeed. But also how slow she was, and large heel angles at low wind speeds even with less than 1/2 of her max sail area.
Downdrafts are not that uncommon in squalls, and as seen here, are pretty dangerous.


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#4 John B

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Posted 09 April 2019 - 09:14 AM

There was a lot of discussion on various sailing websites at the time and immediately after with some top input from naval architects who worked with this type of vessel.There were serious reservations about it's real stability curve as I remember it.
The other factor that resonated with me was the fact they had one epirb .Even one other signal would have at least made the local authorities take it seriously instead of basically waiting a day or two to do anything.
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#5 Above-the-Fold

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 07:52 AM

What got me was that the 2/O did not perceive a threat to the vessel in good time and when he did was unable to steer away because the autopilot had a lock on it that prevented the rudder moving more than 5 degrees at a time. But, yeah, it probably would have just been a scary few minutes had the doors and windows on the port side been sealed.


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#6 ex Elly

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 02:14 PM

Maybe he should have luffed up, instead of trying to bear away?


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#7 raz88

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 05:15 PM

But, yeah, it probably would have just been a scary few minutes had the doors and windows on the port side been sealed.

I thought I read somewhere in the report that the stability of the boat was such that once it went past 70 degrees it wasn't coming back.

Maybe he should have luffed up, instead of trying to bear away?

I wondered the same. I guess with a square rig on the forward mast you run the risk of the square sails filling and blowing the bow down leaving you with the wind on the beam again?
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#8 Island Time

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Posted 10 April 2019 - 06:39 PM

No way, not in a square rigger, many have been lost "caught all aback"
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#9 Elenya

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 03:20 PM

Maybe he should have luffed up, instead of trying to bear away?

Having spent several years as master of a few square rig vessels I can answer that question. Simply put it is quite easy to knock a vessel over sideways, but not easy to tip it over end over end. With 'squares' you do not have the ability to round up and let sheets fly, as a fore and aft rig vessel may do, as the squares will remain full albeit with wind on the wrong side of the sail. With sails aback, no speed and thus no steerage, the end is not good. Best to use speed , bear away, and if required start the  peeling squares from the top.

 

Of course even better is to be prepared but we all gets things wrong sometimes.

 

hope that helps.

 

The report is a reminder to us all that having the hatch and vents open is not the best option in some conditions.


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#10 ex Elly

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 02:21 PM

Thanks Elenya, that make sense.


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