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Where is Yachting going?


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#41 splat

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Posted 16 June 2019 - 03:25 PM

Interesting discussion re costs versus utility.  If I sit down and look at boat ownership on a pure cost basis … anyone who I explained it too would most probably commit me to an asylum. Costs alone it does not add up...in fact... it is financially absurd. I earn a modest income and work very hard to do so like many do -  to pay for my boat. I have given up many things to enable continued ownership and also drive a twenty year old car that is worth less than my tiller pilot or a new # 3 jib. 

 

However, the boat to me is way more to me than what it costs. It represents and delivers a pure freedom in an increasingly fast paced and challenging world, the ability to actively seek solitude, new challenges, fun times with family,  experience fear at times and provide constant learning including electrics, navigation, splicing etc

 

If I look at the cost of ownership I have by way of example:

Ross 30 - 2.9 beam , 2.4 draft , Composite construction

10 metre Marina berth - $370 per month

Insurance - $750 per year

Memberships - $450 per year, VHF users subs 90.00 per annum

Haul outs - wash and hold only - this year $800 (Cheap)

Annual Maintenance haul out excluding time and labour - $1200

Travel to boat - CHC to Waikawa - 380kms (4.5 to 5hrs) each time one way - $100.00

Sails - Indicative - New Main circa - $8000-9500 - New # 1 jib - $4000-5000, New Spinnaker $3000.00

Motor - Annual servicing by self - $300.00

Aux fuel and oil - $800.00

Running and fixed rigging repairs and maintenance - $2000.00 per year

Improvements- AIS, MFD, instruments and installation at cost + 5% +GST - ($5500) 

EWOF initial - Cabling and Certification - $550 re cert every four years ( $220 inspection fee)

Cat 2/3 - every two years $200 minimum

Raft Capital cost  and re - cert every three years $2000 + $850 -1000 every three years

EPIRB, PLB - ??

Garmin In reach annual subs???

Lifejackets testing/certification ???

Tools ???

Dinghy repairs and maintenance annual - $120

Aux motor service - $200 - in warranty

PHRF cert - $180 - annually

and so on - does it make sense on a boat that the market suggests might be worth 20k on a good day regardless of presentation and equipment list … nope

 

Recently and somewhat ironically, I have had persons approach me to borrow my boat for a regatta...I'm not in an financial or philanthropic position to facilitate such a request as I'm sure some are and yet I feel guilty because I'm not assisting participation and growth in sailing!

 

Wheels - sorry to hear about your loss - if you need a day out in the sounds please get in touch.


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#42 Island Time

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Posted 16 June 2019 - 03:47 PM

Damn right Splat. It's like asking to borrow your Mrs for us truly committed sailors!
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There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worth doing, as simply messing about in boats


#43 rmiker

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Posted 16 June 2019 - 04:29 PM

The cost of boating, not just racing, is becoming harder to afford. It is not just the boats and their keep alone, but as BP has said, the cost of living is one biggy.
We recently had to give up our boat. It has been heart breaking for both of us. It was our life almost. We are only one income.
My wife earns what used to be considered a damn good wage of $25/hr ($50K/yr) A very very good wage for Marlborough, which is nicknamed the 10 dollar town. Our mortgage is very modest when compared to what some people have. The average rent is now at a median of $438 here in Blenheim and our we are on a plus side having a mortgage lower than the cost of rent. Our power usage is very low. Our rates are low because of where we live. We do not smoke and buy takeaways once per fortnight. We may have a wine once a month. We live just 10Kms from our place of work.
Yet we are struggling to have enough money to pay all the bills and maintain a boat on top. It was becoming a huge financial stress and some big expenses where coming up with Antifouling her again and we had no extra income to cover it. She needed new House batteries, She needed some rot removed. The list went on and it got to a point where we had to sell. I found that impossible. You only need to take a look at Trademe to see some spectacular boats for sale cheap at the mo. Some real bargains are to be had if you in launches on Trademe. Then I had a major issue take place. A Solar panel failed and the battery went flat and thus the bilge pump failed and the bilge filled to the engine level. No water internally, but a lot of the gear around the engine room needs sorting. I had two choices. Wreck the boat or give it away. I managed to find someone to give it away to. So we have walked away from a huge investment, both monetary and personal.
But I know I am not on my own.

Wheels: I feel for you it is so hard and there is so much working against us..

We have just gone through the exact same situation and sold the boat for $1 on trademe while she was sitting on the cradle an hour after hauling from the water.

Spent a lot of money on a boat worth retail max 15k.. Age and health care let me down.. Just spent 18k on new engine and repairs.. Maxed out financially and bang need a minor op to correct a debilitating condition but no not going to happen according to the Waikato DHB so boat gone.. minimum 50k down the tubes :(

However will be going back for more I hope :)


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#44 Bad Kitty

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Posted 16 June 2019 - 04:49 PM

FFS Splat, I think a lot of us would prefer that it wasn't laid out in black & white like that!

Easier to pretend that it isn't that much if Splat doesn't do a damn spreadsheet!

:wtf: 


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When I die make sure my wife doesn't sell Bad Kitty for what I told her it cost!

#45 Kiwifish

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Posted 17 June 2019 - 08:56 AM

Was yachting this expensive back in the 70’s hey days?

Did everyone back then have big yachts tied up at expensive marinas? Get hauled out by big machines? Did they sit in cradles to be antifouled? Have electrical systems that could “plug in” and require inspections and certs? Did they have electric everything?

I wasn’t there, but the books I’ve read seem to give the impression that boats where smaller, more simple, swing moored, more diy maintenance, antifoul on a grid or the beach, no fancy gizmos to break down or replace.

Honest question because I wasn’t there! but it does seem we modern folk have increased our yachting costs our selves? Surely 70’s folk are the same as us modern folk? Had same fun and adventure?

Anyone here who sailed in the 70’s able to comment? Did you or your parents keep the boat at a marina for your step on convenience? Have it “plugged in”? Have it hauled out by machines? Etc etc

Why do we complain when costs are high when we do it the expensive way??
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#46 Island Time

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Posted 17 June 2019 - 09:23 AM

Hmm, yep, absolutely right. Not for me in the 70's, more 80's. My first keeler was a Raven 26. Petrol ford Anglia engine. No electrical other than engine start and nav lights. Kero lamp inside. No fridge. No pressure water. No heating. Cold vinyl squabs. Dacron sails. Kept her on a pile mooring.  

But - she still consumed all my "spare" money!!!

Had a great time in her and learned a lot. First coastal trip in her was round North Cape to Mana....


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There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worth doing, as simply messing about in boats


#47 Dagwood

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Posted 17 June 2019 - 10:02 AM

I wasn’t there, but the books I’ve read seem to give the impression that boats where smaller, more simple, swing moored, more diy maintenance, antifoul on a grid or the beach, no fancy gizmos to break down or replace.

 

That's how I remember it. Pressure water was a luxury. Now I look at the complexity on offer at boat shows and wonder if it's progress...


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#48 mattm

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Posted 17 June 2019 - 11:46 AM

I think we now know better than to antifoul over the beach.

People now partake in a wider variety of pass times, work long hours and sit in traffic, these all leave less time for boating, meaning being in a marina berth reduces the admin and time involved in going boating, without marinas, I’d think participation would be a heap lower.

As people become busier, and office jobs more prolific, individuals ability, and again, time, to fix things them selves becomes reduced, meaning boat owners are more inclined to pay someone else to fix their boats - they either can’t do it themselves, can afford not to have to, or don’t want to spend what little time they have for boating doing repairs, but instead out boating. This too means they can’t fix them themselves while out if they break down, meaning more reliability is required, therefor better engines etc.

Less time to learn and perfect skills also means, for example, better navigation equipment is required.

The only bit that’s a mastery to me, is why are we all so busy? What are we doing, and is it making us happier than before? I suspect maybe not.
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#49 mattm

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Posted 17 June 2019 - 11:48 AM

In summary, do we spend more time earning money, because we need more money to make up for having less time?
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#50 Maté

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Posted 17 June 2019 - 12:24 PM

Never forget that boats are toys


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"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference." - Mark Twain





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