Jump to content


Photo

Golden Globe race


  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic

#1 Rehabilitated

Rehabilitated

    Rehabilitated

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 868 posts
  • Locationon the waters Land and else where

Posted 20 August 2019 - 09:49 AM

POSTED BY 

"Stev Pope Advanced Members

1,654 posts

Posted Yesterday, 05:55 PM 19/08/2019

From the Golden Globe Race Committee: Imo. relevant to Cat 1 and if taken with a dose of common sense could / should make cat 1 redundant

The changes to the notice of race may surprise many.

 

"We do NOT mandate a drogue or special storm training or mandatory guidelines on masts and spars, as some suggest we could. In fact we have dropped all previous regulations that existed on masts and spars (other than lengths) and are leaving this critical issue entirely to the skippers. This is in the true spirit of the GGR. They know what to expect. We and they, are and have been, talking about it at length. Their riggers and mast makers are acutely aware of the serious challenge. they saw what happened. anything we mandate is not relevant. If the GGR said entrants must have a rig like X with Y and include Z, we would be creating a one design fleet, which no one wants.
In relation to storm tactics and equipment like storm drogues, no individual or expert exists with a sure solution, or the ultimate answer. Every boat, storm, wave pattern and situation IS different, so we will NOT regulate what the entrants must do, or should have. Like all good sailors, we keep discussing it, learning and researching, then make our own decisions and face our own destiny. their life is in their hands. If there is one thing all entrants are very aware of and serious about, it is how they plan to survive the Southern Ocean. They do not need us to tell them and we have no guarantee to give."

 

As the other thread was locked regarding the last race it is interesting most of the discussions in the last  race in that thread have been seriously considered especial my point it was ridiculous having the spinnaker poles on the mast. Loose the mast o/b and no spars for a jury rig. How they come to the conclusion by stipulating a rig format would be creating a one design fleet. Pretty weak argument as The second sentence after that contradicts the statement " Every boat, storm, wave pattern and situation is different"  To have a one design I thought the length, designer, hull shape, keel, rudders, engines, rig style had to be the same. 

 

http://crew.org.nz/f...from-ynz/page-2   #15  Steve Pope. 19/08/2019.


  • -1

©  2013 2014 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019

 

RETIRED ADVANCING MULTIHULL, MONOHULL SAILOR, ORGANIZER , NAVIGATOR, PREVIOUS SKIPPER

OCEAN COASTAL WATERS COMBINED, CRUISER / RACER ADVANCING MEMBER.


#2 Fish

Fish

    Advanced Member

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,436 posts

Posted 20 August 2019 - 10:41 AM

Best keep this thread in YNZ, where, as per the original post, it is most relevant.


  • 0

#3 Rehabilitated

Rehabilitated

    Rehabilitated

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 868 posts
  • Locationon the waters Land and else where

Posted 20 August 2019 - 10:53 AM

Best keep this thread in YNZ, where, as per the original post, it is most relevant.

 

[ A ] Disagree Cat 1 YNZ is CAT 1 YNZ,

 

[ B ] GLODEN GLOBE RACE IS GLODEN GLOBE RACE. 


  • 0

©  2013 2014 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019

 

RETIRED ADVANCING MULTIHULL, MONOHULL SAILOR, ORGANIZER , NAVIGATOR, PREVIOUS SKIPPER

OCEAN COASTAL WATERS COMBINED, CRUISER / RACER ADVANCING MEMBER.


#4 MarkMT

MarkMT

    Advanced Member

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 960 posts
  • LocationLake Zurich, Illinois or Waiuku, NZ, depending on how I feel. And snow, especially snow.

Posted 20 August 2019 - 12:11 PM

This has already been covered here in RaceTalk... http://crew.org.nz/f...notice-of-race/

 

The discussion under YNZ is completely appropriate as well.


  • 1

#5 Steve Pope

Steve Pope

    Advanced Member

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,675 posts

Posted 20 August 2019 - 12:35 PM

This has already been covered here in RaceTalk... http://crew.org.nz/f...notice-of-race/

 

The discussion under YNZ is completely appropriate as well.

Sorry Mark, I had missed that, and a lot more interesting detail as well, I put it up under YNZ as I considered it the appropriate place for it, and that it was in my opinion relevant to Cat 1 rules in NZ, and the folk who decide what they will be. If the GGR was in NZ maybe Rehab might have had a point, but it is not.


  • 1

#6 MarkMT

MarkMT

    Advanced Member

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 960 posts
  • LocationLake Zurich, Illinois or Waiuku, NZ, depending on how I feel. And snow, especially snow.

Posted 20 August 2019 - 04:05 PM

Oh no problem, re-posting it on YNZ was entirely on point.


  • 0

#7 Rehabilitated

Rehabilitated

    Rehabilitated

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 868 posts
  • Locationon the waters Land and else where

Posted 21 August 2019 - 10:51 AM

Sorry Mark, I had missed that, and a lot more interesting detail as well, I put it up under YNZ as I considered it the appropriate place for it, and that it was in my opinion relevant to Cat 1 rules in NZ, and the folk who decide what they will be. If the GGR was in NZ maybe Rehab might have had a point, but it is not.

 

Sorry disagree.

Your heading for a start is misleading as no way have the GGR committee ever suggested that CAT 1 should be made redundant it is only your opinion.

With the climate and severe weather becoming more frequent and devastating CaT 1 should not be made redundant.

It would appear some have larger boats that they want to race but can't afford. If so sell your boat, buy a smaller boat and you will be able to meet CAT 1 regs as any changes will take yonks' like most wheels in big brother..

No quotation marks or url in order your post is relative to the title or that it could be verified as summary of GGR Committee opinions.

I add this and quote a article with  an interview analysing / comments from Don McIntyre re the race and changes plus  with an experience respected off shore racer and participant.

What can we learn from Race?

"The Golden Globe is different from the established ocean races in every way, and it fills a very particular, yet surprisingly popular, niche in the short-handed calendar. It needs to avoid repeating the same problems in this edition, but with the mooted rule changes, the 2022 Golden Globe may be a very different beast from the 2018-19 Golden Globe "

"Whether you think the Golden Globe Race concept madness or genius probably depends on whether you adhere to the view that traditional long-keeled yachts are the most intrinsically seaworthy."

"In 1968 nobody knew what type of boats would perform best. “They weren’t the right boats last time around – Suhaili was not, Joshua was not, but they created unique stories,” points out solo racer Mike Golding, who has sailed through the Southern Ocean multiple times in BT Challenge yachts and IMOCA 60s."

 

"Actually Robin Knox-Johnston’s first choice of vessel for his 1968 circumnavigation, a 53ft steel schooner, would not have been allowed under the new race rules."

My opinion Even R K - J was wise enough not to sail such small vessels.

"On the face of it, they did not come out of it very well. Of the 18 entrants, 13 had retired by the time Jean-Luc Van Den Heede won in 212 days. Five were dismasted. Four of those were abandoned."

"Three more had to stop racing after their self-steering systems failed. Others have been plagued by extreme barnacle growth and toxic mould, due to the sheer length of time spent at sea. The last skippers to finish were battling infections and food shortages.
But is such a rate of attrition surprising? Don McIntyre admits that the drop-out rate has been higher than expected, “As a gut feeling I didn’t think we’d have this low number of finishers, I was thinking maybe half or just less than half might have been realistic.”

Comment Mark Slats.

"The yachts’ relatively light weight is also a factor – the Rustler 36 is about 7.5 tons unladen. “I’ve done a non-stop round-the-world before on a 51-footer, it was a steel Buchanan, and it’s just a whole different game,” commented 2nd-placed finisher Mark Slats.

“That boat weighs 20 tons, so you can leave it beam on to the waves for quite a long time and nothing really happens. But on these little boats I get really nervous – the boat has to keep going forwards or you just get in trouble.”

"There was no prerequisite to carry a drogue, and no briefing discussion of storm tactics before the start, although Slats says it was a big topic of conversation among the group of skippers he chatted with on the radio."

 

Steering issues

Windvane failures led up to two of the dismastings. According to McIntyre, Are Wiig was lying hove to in 35-40 knot winds because he was working on a repair to the coupling of his Monitor windvane.

McIntyre says Goodall had deployed her series drogue before she was pitchpoled because she too had been repairing a coupling on her Monitor. When her Rustler 36 righted one side of the drogue bridle had broken away.

Three competitors – Francesco Cappelletti, Nabil Amra and Philippe Péché, all carrying Beaufort windvanes – retired following problems with the vanes or the brackets.

"Windvane reliability is an area organisers are looking to improve in the future. McIntyre is reluctant to prescribe equipment, but says they are considering making recommendations for the 2022 race."

 

MY OPINION Perhaps YNZ should take note and consider when he makes his recommendations although his recommendations re mast and rig where completely wrong. OPINIONS FROM THE COMPETATORS WOULD BE MORE VALID.

 

Plus they should consider this perhaps to ad to CAT 1, I say consider !!! if they are taking any notice of the threads.

 

"The Golden Globe is the only race that requires entrants to demonstrate they can set a jury rig effectively (using spinnaker poles) before the start. Wiig covered 400 miles to South Africa successfully under his. But Goodall lost DHL Starlight’s remaining spinnaker pole, boom and sails during her pitch pole."

"There will be a change to the course for 2022. Next time the fleet will have to round the island of Trinidade in the South Atlantic to port. “It takes out the whole issue of trying to cut through the South Atlantic High,” explains McIntyre. “That was challenging on the boats and it wasn’t enjoyable, because they had a lot of windward work.”

Other changes include an increase in the qualification requirements for skippers, doubled to 2,000 miles in the yacht in which they will enter."

 

QUOTE Dee Caffari, "And I think now the question is, is it acceptable for us to abandon these boats? Is it acceptable to leave it as a hazard or to break up in our oceans? Should we have a responsibility to scuttle our boat if we know we’re not going to have the funds to salvage it? It’s a conversation that has to start in our sport.”

Definitely YES

Source

https://www.yachting...3ZiMfPLMarT4.99

 

How is all that relevant to CAT 1

 

The correct way in my opinion if you what changes to the NZ Cat 1 regulations is through your own individual yacht clubs for a resolution to be voted on and if passed then taken on to YNZ. by the clubs representative which will carry more weight than a small minority that YNZ, the world body and clubs could consider REBELS. Then YNZ takes the matter on to the world body that sets the rules and CAT 1 conditions for the individual countries affiliated clubs to administer. A individual can not make direct contact with the world governing organisation they only consider via in NZ's case YNZ. I agree with some of the comments that some off the CAT 1 regs are ridiculous or out date especially when it comes to flares is one issue. But posting such as Stev Pope which can be interpreted as misleading and manipulating reports/ comments / and implying them as quotations, which is totally unprofessional and borders on dishonesty. Some off the other posts does little to give YNZ the inclination to even consider some of the postings as browsing through the numerous threads and new topics I get the impression they are trying to distance themselves from this website. They started off in the beginning with enthusiasm answering questions fairly quickly and now no response or contact so and so ...


  • 0

©  2013 2014 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019

 

RETIRED ADVANCING MULTIHULL, MONOHULL SAILOR, ORGANIZER , NAVIGATOR, PREVIOUS SKIPPER

OCEAN COASTAL WATERS COMBINED, CRUISER / RACER ADVANCING MEMBER.


#8 Black Panther

Black Panther

    Advanced Member

  • Administrators
  • 5,623 posts

Posted 21 August 2019 - 11:11 AM

Just make cat 1 optional for cruisers. Nothing to do with any other country as i think we are the only country that does this.
Racing is dying here anyway.
  • 0
  Two figures sat side by side, staring at the Sea. One said to the other, “You know that one day we will die.” And the other friend replied, “But all of the other days WE WILL LIVE!”

 


#9 Rehabilitated

Rehabilitated

    Rehabilitated

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 868 posts
  • Locationon the waters Land and else where

Posted 21 August 2019 - 01:24 PM

Just make cat 1 optional for cruisers. Nothing to do with any other country as i think we are the only country that does this.
Racing is dying here anyway.

 You got to kidding surely All Be informed then.

 

World Sailing Offshore Special Regulations
The World Sailing Offshore Special Regulations (OSR) govern offshore racing for monohulls and multihulls, structural features, yacht equipment, personal equipment and training.
The OSR is republished every two years and the latest edition is for 2018-2019 with updates January 2019. You can download it either in full or by category and view the interpretations of the World Sailing Special Regulations Sub-Committee below.

 

Free

 

https://www.sailing.org/specialregs.

 

 

https://www.sailing....lregs/index.php 


  • 0

©  2013 2014 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019

 

RETIRED ADVANCING MULTIHULL, MONOHULL SAILOR, ORGANIZER , NAVIGATOR, PREVIOUS SKIPPER

OCEAN COASTAL WATERS COMBINED, CRUISER / RACER ADVANCING MEMBER.


#10 BOIGuy

BOIGuy

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 73 posts

Posted 21 August 2019 - 05:16 PM

 You got to kidding surely All Be informed then.

 

World Sailing Offshore Special Regulations
The World Sailing Offshore Special Regulations (OSR) govern offshore racing for monohulls and multihulls, structural features, yacht equipment, personal equipment and training.
The OSR is republished every two years and the latest edition is for 2018-2019 with updates January 2019. You can download it either in full or by category and view the interpretations of the World Sailing Special Regulations Sub-Committee below.

 

Free

 

https://www.sailing.org/specialregs.

 

 

https://www.sailing....lregs/index.php

Black Panthers talking about making cat 1 for cruisers optional, nothing to do with what your on about, maybe if you calmed down a bit and read the posts before yelling you might make some relevant responses.


  • 2




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users