Guest Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 I'm currently looking at purchasing a 26 ft yacht in Auckland. I'm a beginner and am wanting to ease into sailing. I've narrowed my search down to two boats, a salthouse 26 and a raven 26. I'm after a boat where once I get competent, I can sail with my wife and infant son, and where my wife doesn't have to do anything but watch my son. The raven doesnt have a roller furler, but has a few other aspects that I do like. Who can I talk to, to get a good idea on what a roller furler would cost to install? Is there a crowd in Auckland who would do this? Asking price for the Salthouse is $16k, and the Raven $14k, so I can easily justify a couple of grand, maybe a bit more if that is in the ball park? Link to post Share on other sites
Atom Ant 0 Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 Look near the top right of this page for an ad by Sailutions. They do roller furling systems and can give you all the advice you need. Link to post Share on other sites
Murky 1 Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 ...just bearing in mind that the equation needs to include the hardware plus the sail that goes on it. When they first came out, the old thinking was commonly "I will just get a rooted headsails cut down as a furler" but...well, that sentence kind of speaks for itself. If you are able to dredge up some of the old posts about dacron sails and cruising laminates, Booboo made some comments in there that are worth reading. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 great, thanks i"ll suss it out. I had anticipated getting some new/newer sails so shouldn't be a show stopper. Link to post Share on other sites
Absolution 7 Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 Furlers are great things for cruising but I think its worth pointing out that furlers tend to be more widely used on bigger boats where the size of the sails makes them difficult to manage. You won't see many 26fters with furlers because raising and lowering a headsail that is hanked on to the forestay on 26'er isn't really that hard. You may be solving a problem that you aren't ever going to encounter and the $ may well be more benefit if spent on something else for the boat. I'm not saying don't do it, just wait until you have sailed it a few times without a furler. Link to post Share on other sites
Battleship 100 Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 I have to agree, furlers are great but can add alot of complexity and cost. Pretty hard to go wrong with the simplicity of hanks, you sails will last longer out of the weather as well. I have heard of people adding and extra line to pull their hanked sails down so they can lower them from the cockpit which may also be an option for you. Link to post Share on other sites
TimW 1 Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 There is no hard and fast rule but generally Furlers on boats 12m and over. An 8m boat generally doesn't need a furler. The option of hanks short handed is probably best. One of the biggest reasons for this is that there is a loss of upwind performance with a furled headsail. Compare a Furled genoa on a Raven 26, with a number 1 and a number 3. in size the furled genoa will be smaller than a number 1. It may not mean much but you will get quite a lot less performance in under 15 knots upwind. But when its critical is in strong winds, the number 3 will go to weather well and be comfortable and tack through nice angles, making those heinous beats against the tide in lumpy seas much more bearable. The boat with the furled genoa in those same conditions is not in anywhere near as good a shape. As the boats get smaller, the "loss in upwind performance" from the furler plays a more significant roll. For example in a 40 that could go 7.5 knots upwind, but with a furling genoa only does 6 or 6.5 knots is no big deal, but scale it down and the loss of performance is more significant as the Raven that could do 4.5 knots with the right sail, can only do 3 or 3.5 with the furled one (which in some places is barely enough to stem the tide). Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 Cheaper to buy a tiller pilot and stick with the hanked on sail. That way the missus can still keep an eye on junior and the boat will perform better anyway. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 that's some great feedback. Thank you all again. Definitely gives me a lot to think about as I weigh them up. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 Essentially you'll be singlehanding while your wife looks after the kid. I singlehand and have a rollerfurler on a 29ft boat.......and I would not be without it. Having to leave the cockpit to reef the main, which doesn't take much time at all, is enough when a big blow comes. I have a tiller pilot but small boats don't bash through waves well and tiller pilots can't manage rough seas. I'd hate to have to spend all that extra time out of the cockpit fighting a headsail on the foredeck while the boat flails all over the place. An uncontrolled gybe is not fun. Loss of preformace into the wind is not that bad with a roller furler, just select which sail you need for expected weather before you leave harbour....and if your choice is wrong, it's not the end of the world to take a bit longer getting there. Remember, if you want your wife to continue to sail with you, you must not frighten her by being over canvassed or out of control. Link to post Share on other sites
ab1974 1 Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 I have a 26' yacht and take my wife and our 2 year old out regularly. I have a hanked on headsail. I find it easy to raise and drop the headsail. However, doing a sail change would be a little tougher. My wife is quite happy to take the helm and make sure our 2yo doesn't wander off when I hoist or reduce sail. As a rule of thumb, unless it is forecast to be pretty light, I generally use our #2 or most often the #3 headsail, so I might be a little underpowered but generally with just the three of us on board without anyone on the rail the #3 and full main seem to work well and make going through tacks easy with just a working jib up. Means that all I am doing is putting in a reef if the breeze come up, all while having a headsail that is pretty flat and has a good shape. I thought about a furler initially but decided to see how I went without one and to be honest haven't missed it. Link to post Share on other sites
Farrari 4 Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 I had a furler on my 26ft Tracker and I wouldn't have been without it. I didn't have to worry about where to store the sail when out cruising for extended periods of time and there were no head sail change dramas when the wind got up. I paid about $1800 all up for mine installed and I think they are slightly cheaper than that now a days. Mine was a Furlex and it worked really well for a small boat. Make sure you don't get a really cheap one that doesn't have a pre-tensioner for the furling line as they have a tendency to jam at the worst possible time. You will need a headsail that is compatible with a furler tho. At a minimum it will need the right bolt rope size and a UV guard. They normally build sails intended for a furler slightly differently so as they hold some shape when partially furled. Link to post Share on other sites
Atom Ant 0 Posted March 16, 2011 Share Posted March 16, 2011 My father had a Davidson 28 for many years. He said one of the best things he ever did was put a furler on it. Sailing performance didn't suffer at all when it was fully unfurled, but yes of course it deteriorated noticeably when you tried to sail with it furled unless of course you were sailing with eased sheets. One thing that is worth noting was if we tried to change to a smaller sail in windy weather. As is well noted sailing upwind with a partly furled headsail is an exercise in futility. But changing the headsail in windy weather was bloody difficult and often we'd get the new headsail partly up and it would start flogging and flaying around and get pulled out of the track. A real pain. Conversely dropping a headsail in windy weather was bad too. As it drops it comes out of the track and there is nothing to stop it taking off, except that it is attached at three points. For a boat as small as a Raven I'd think carefully before investing in a furler. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 I don't agree with those that say a furler isn't needed for a smaller boat. I had a 26' & loved the furler. I thought it was the best invention since sliced bread and the 2hp dinghy outboard. I think it is especially helpful for the novice sailer, which I was and still am. There is a universal sailing truth of "the test is first and the lesson later". I always furled in too late when the wind was twice as strong in the afternoon than was forecasted. I kept a close eye on my furler to make sure it was working well, but I wouldn't want a boat without one now. Good sailing! Link to post Share on other sites
John B 106 Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 If you get a furler which will take kiwi slides you can have best of both worlds. Also they're easy to retrofit to your existing sails. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 Farrari has a good point about sail storage as this a real hassle. Leaving my hanked on sail on the foredeck is ugly and unseamanlike. I've never had a furler but I don't really want one. There are too many other more important things to spend the money on. Link to post Share on other sites
Marshy 30 Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 One thing we did notice on the 1020 my parents owned with a furler was how much more sailing you did, Even just motoring bay to bay. We just unfurled the Jib and motor sailed. Easy to do when its just pull a string etc (We were lazy kids!) When you impulsively want to sail a little bit you dont need to fish a sail out of the locker and run sheets etc. They have their place... Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 The furler was one of the things at the top of the list of the best pieces of equipment I ever fitted to my boat. The only negative is that you (or I) can get a little lazy and not take the sail down when you really should. Link to post Share on other sites
John B 106 Posted March 17, 2011 Share Posted March 17, 2011 Especially westhaven. That black s%$#.. brake dust/ tarmac/ bridge stuff is there forever once its on. Link to post Share on other sites
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