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Does Fuel Set make your engine smoke?


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From Liquid Engineering Home Page

 

Fuel Set absorbs any water present. The bug then suffocates and is dissolved allowing it to pass through the filters to be burnt off harmlessly. The bug cannot re-infest when Fuel Set is present in your fuel.

 

And…….

 

Water emulsion or water held in suspension can cause serious damage to fuel system components. The water content causes loss of lubrication resulting in worn fuel pumps and injectors.

 

Emulsified water also reacts with chemicals in the fuel at the point of combustion, which causes contaminates such as gum, wax and resin to separate and foul fuel systems, especially injectors. Emulsified water can seriously degrade certain types of fuel filters.

 

A water emulsion, left untreated eventually separates from the fuel and provides an environment for the 'diesel bug' .

 

Fuel Set chemically bonds emulsified or free water into the fuel. This eliminates the harmful effects of water in fuel systems. Having water as part of the fuels’ make-up lowers smoke and nitrous oxide emissions.

 

I initially treated a diesel bug infestation with a Wynns biocide. This seemed to work wonders but it was practically impossible to remove all the resultant sludge and accompanying water so I turned to Fuel Set to remove all remaining emulsified and water in suspension in the fuel and dissolve the bug. I use very little fuel and with the top-ups done, I'm sure that I still have lots of the infected/treated fuel in the tank.

 

Now I have black streaks left behind on the hull from the exhaust water and plumes of white smoke when the engine is loaded. Could it be the Fuel Set ………or do I have some other problem lurking?

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I can't believe the snake oil salesmen are still trying to convince people that it is a good idea to put water & biological baddies in whatever form, bonded, tied, taped or trussed, through a fuel pump and injector. The only thing that should go through your fuel system post secondary filter is clean diesel. Mechanical removal of contaminants from the tank is the only safe option. Using voodoo potions will by pass the benefit of water/fuel separation in the primary filter. One possible option for you is to use a mobile fuel polishing system to try to clean your existing fuel as much as possible.

And to answer your question, without the benefit of diagnosis I would say that there is a very high likelihood that Fuel Set is the cause of your smoke problems and potentially expensive problem they might be. Is the engine still developing full power?

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I don't know about the power - I've been unable to take her out for a while. My filters have all been spotless (the separator seems to have done its job very well) and in all I've drained about a drop from the water trap in the primary filter.

 

I got a bad load of fuel somewhere………..but surely there is water in a lot of suppliers tanks around the Gulf and hence in the fuel? Just the water vapour in the air means that water molecules move in and out of solution in your fuel, let alone condensation from the inside surface of a half empty tank.

:problem:

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PW is spot on.

Lets go through this piece by piece.

Fuel Set absorbs any water present.

So what is meant by "absorb"? A paper towel or sponge absorbs. The water is still present in either. In a chemical sense, there are certain liquids that will "mix" with water. Most are some form of Alcohol. But you still have water. Water, nor Alcohol will not mix with Diesel. Without a chemical reaction, you can not turn water into something else. The only advantage of such a liquid, is that it may make the water slightly more difficult to pass through a filter and thus it may settle out to the bottom of the tank or filter faster. But please note that I said may/might.

he bug then suffocates and is dissolved allowing it to pass through the filters to be burnt off harmlessly. The bug cannot re-infest when Fuel Set is present in your fuel.

Soffocate...well not exactly. Bug is one of two things. It is either Algae or Bacteria. Both live in the water. Remove the water and both have nothing to grow in. Neither will dissolve. It can die and the biocide(assuming Fuelset has a biocide) will stop it from growing again, while the Biocide is present. Plus, simply put, no water, no bug. So if you keep the water out or filter it out quickly, then you won't get the Bug either.

I am very concerned by the comment that the Bug will dissolve. It will not!!!

Water emulsion or water held in suspension can cause serious damage to fuel system components. The water content causes loss of lubrication resulting in worn fuel pumps and injectors.

Firstly, water does not stay in suspension for very long. But OK, so lets say the tank is stirred up and the water gets into the fuel system. Yes water will cause corrosion in steel fuel lines, and in pumps and so on. Even though there is Diesel present and Diesel is oil, it is quite surprising how must corrosion can be caused by water. But it does have to be an amount to be able to sit somewhere for a period of time to cause the corrosion. If you have really good filters, you should be protected against water getting to the engine. But should it manage to get there and to the injector, then a decent drop of water can cause the Injector tip to be damaged via the water exploding as it is punched through the stinking hot tip under huge pressure and via erroding the tip.

If the "emulsion" of whatever it is and the water mixed with it makes it through the filters, there is no miracle liquid that will "harmlessly" cause the water to burn.

You have to have a large amount of water to cause loss of lubrication and that amount of water would not allow the engine to run anyway.

Emulsified water also reacts with chemicals in the fuel at the point of combustion, which causes contaminates such as gum, wax and resin to separate and foul fuel systems, especially injectors.

Confused sentence there. Firstly, there is a lot of water in the air the engine sucks in. Especially for a boat engine. Far far more than what would be in the fuel. But aside from that, the Fuel/water in the combustion process does not go back to the Fuel system. It goes out the exhaust.

Emulsified water can seriously degrade certain types of fuel filters.
I suppose you could argue that point. Some "cheap" filters are simply paper and can break down, but mostly they just clogg up and won't pass fuel at all.
A water emulsion, left untreated eventually separates from the fuel and provides an environment for the 'diesel bug' .
I think that's the only correct statement they have made in the entire article.
Fuel Set chemically bonds emulsified or free water into the fuel. This eliminates the harmful effects of water in fuel systems.

Simply, the last thing you ever want to have happen. The water is still there. It has simply mixed into a chemical(as I said above, usually Alcohol) but it is still water and besides, the alcohol on it's own has a certain amount of water in it naturally, plus pure alcohol(if you can get such a thing) is just as harmful to the fuel and injector system as the water is.

Note that they then contradict their own statement.

Having water as part of the fuels’ make-up lowers smoke and nitrous oxide emissions.

Plus it is a totally false statement.
Now I have black streaks left behind on the hull from the exhaust water and plumes of white smoke when the engine is loaded. Could it be the Fuel Set ………or do I have some other problem lurking?

Sorry, the answers to that are so many and complex and varied, it simply is unfair to try and answer from just that description. Someone really needs to take a look.

But one thing I can say for sure, DO NOT let that stuff run through your Fuel system. You need to clean the tanks and the system of water, sludge and anything else that is not Diesel. Sadly there is not a chemical that will do that for you. Well not one that will leave the Tank and maybe Boat intacked afterwards.

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Out of interest Wheels

 

Emulsified water

 

Is this a common term in the engineering world?

 

To me, emulsification is something that happens to fats, so that they 'mix' with water.

 

Thanks

M

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Correct M.

In fact there is no such thing as Emulsified water. You can however, have a Water Emulsion An Emulsion is where two normally immiscible liquids hold together in a seemingly mixed state. Milk would be the most common one. Milk Fat and Water mix together to form Milk. But if you either leave it for sometime or you speed up the process with centrifugal force, you can separate the two again. So you can see that a Water Emulsion in fuel is actually a bad thing because it is something that is simply mixing with water. The water is still there.

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Thanks Wheels - couldn't see how water could emulsify.

 

Fat with water - yes - like what the dishwashing liquid does to the fats when you wash dishes.

 

So are they really talking about emulsifying the diesel oil with the water (rather than the other way around)? That would not seem such a good idea.

 

Thanks for your clear answer.

 

M

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like what the dishwashing liquid does to the fats when you wash dishes.
Ye..es, (he say's hesitantly). There are emulsifiers, but they work a little differently. Detergents and Soaps have molecular chains that have two completely different ends to them. Hydrophobic (water-hating) and hydrophilic (water-loving ). The hydrophobic end repell's water, but attracts to oil and grease. The hydrophilic end of the same molecule means that the molecule will be attracted to water. Mechanical energy or agitation is then used to pull the grime away from clothes or dishes and into the larger pool of rinse water. Rinsing washes the detergent and soil away. A surfactant is used to lower the surface tension of the water and thus the "mix" stays in the water better so as it can be washed away.
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Wheels thanks for your detailed reply. Quite honestly I used Fuel Set because many boaties have recommended it to help breakdown the sludge that one cannot easily remove.

 

I understand the physics of why water does not mix with diesel - and that when there is a partial pressure of a gas/vapour above a liquid that there will be movement of that gas/vapour molecules between the two until equilibrium is achieved. Simply, the liquid cannot hold more water than that which it is equilibrium with. Excess water will separate out and, as water is more dense than diesel, will form a layer of water below the diesel…and this is where the "bug" (singular is a poor term) grows.

 

From the above, there will always be some water in your fuel and, because the filters are essentially designed to not allow particles above a certain size to cross them, the water in solution will accompany the fuel to the injectors (H2O is a far smaller molecule than any hydrocarbon found in fuel). This means that water will be pressurised and injected above the cylinder head.

 

Fuel Set claims to be a biocide - well in that it suffocates the bug, but more importantly from my point of view, it promised to breakdown (dissolve) the non-visible crap in my fuel. Essentially I have removed that "crap" which is accessable and all the water which has been precipitated. So in this case, why should the fuel that gets to the injectors contain more water than in a tank that never had been infected or had a water layer in it?

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My old man imported a fuel filter that uses some kind of centrifuge to remove baddies from fuel. It had no mechanical or electrical input and somehow works from the flow of fuel alone. You wouldn't believe it, but it's freeken amazing! He was talking about getting the NZ agency but not sure if he did or not. Either way, if you can get your hands on one then you'll be pretty impressed.

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WT, that is most likely for Oil. Well at least I haven't heard of anything for fuel for us smaller engine type users. The original centrifuge filter (once again for us smaller users) was made by Glacier and their product is called "Spinner" and their latest product is "Spinner ll". Hmmm, in thinking about that, their smallest unit is often used to filter home made bio fuel's, so I suppose the use as a fuel filter could be possible. However, you have to have a high pressure pump to drive it and they are expensive filters. I think you would be better with a Racor Fuel filter to be honest.

As an engine oil filter, it uses the engines oil pressure to run it. There is an inner bowl with two small jets at the bottom of it. As the oil squirts out the jets, the bowl is spun at speeds of up to 7000RPM and the centrifugal force spins out particles down to as low as 0.1micron. For reference, a really good oil filter may remove particles as small as 2 microns. Which means that Carbon, the stuff that makes the engine oil go black, is not removed. The other advantage is that the bowl is removable and you simply remove a dry'ish cake of contaminants and install again. They are normally installed as a secondary bypass filter. You keep the normal engine filter. I am going to take some pictures of my new engine room installation soon and will post some pictures of the filter set up here.

By the way, several companies now make similar centrifugal filters.

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