Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Nope, they did last time, last 2 times actually. As our ACC taxes are decreasing it's sort of going the opposite way than Italy. Do you think all NZers are happy with paying for Giovanni's (the visiting Italian cruiser) 3 months in hospital and rehabilitation as he came off is rented motorbike 1/2 down state highway 1? I'd think most aren't but we do...... and probably at the cost of fixing up some NZers instead. I think some just seem to be holding onto the idea you can still go where you like when you like for nothing or feck all. Those days are on the way out sadly due to greed, apathy and the desire of populations to have huge social welfare payments, free schools, keep poor performing state assets and the like. Either live with it or go now before more fees/taxes/charges arrive, as they surely will, or get on a plane and start burning down Pizzerias and Ferraris until they dump the tax. Due to a sort of similar US Govt rule I think is just wrong and freaky I have chosen knot to go there. The US Govt made their choice and I've made mine, as we both are fully entitled to do. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I hope they don't try it on in the pacific. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I hope they don't try it on in the pacific. G'day mate. Now question is; & thanks KM for bringing it up. How do all the - closer to cruising long-term mob feel? There are several of us in here. - Am sure KM is right - that everyone - everywhere - is puting up their charges - - so know matter where we go cruising to - the costs are rising vertically - will we be able to afford to go cruising in say 3 - 5 - 10 years from now?? Will we knot kneed many thousands of dollars each year to afford to - go cruising for *free* ??? What say you guys? james Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 KM is right, the rot has set in , both in terms of fees and idiot bureaucracy (and the Aussies and Kiwis are not exempt). At present there are still enough destinations available to make it worthwhile, but the decay is happening much faster than I anticipated. What can we do? - rage against the dying of the light wherever and whenever possible. And get back out there as soon as possible and hope you die before it bcomes intolerable. To newbies, I uesd to think maybe 20 years but now I would not be surprised if 5 is closer to the mark. It won't be an overnight dictum saying you can't go cruising, instead it will be death by a thousand cuts. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Totally agree Ogre (Squid was so much easier to spell ) the rot has set in and it's done it fast, faster than I expected also. What's worse the changes seem to be accelerating exponentially. But there are still many places you can go for feck all and many of those are probably more interesting then some of what are traditionally known as destinations anyway, personally the Med has zero interest for me and the Wa. I dropped a email to one of our suppliers in Italy who are mad yachters to see if they have even heard of this tax and/or is there any grizzles about it. The answer maybe interesting.... or knot, we'll see. The east is opening up, some costs in some places still though, and some spots there look rather inviting. Kowloon Bay is one spot I intend to be seen in soonish. So maybe it's knot so much 'Italy is screwing us' maybe we should be thinking more 'Bad luck Italy's economy, Vietnam here comes me and my few bucks'. Hey, if just getting the hell away from civilisation is the call there are lots of small islands and atolls in the Pacific you can anchor off while living cheap as on rice and fresh fish. Actually as twisted as it sounds I'd still like to spend a while cruising from the top of Aussie down to Tassie via the West Coast, bugger the East too many Aussies for my liking. Bit of barter with the locals and there's bound to be a pile of cheap Roo steaks on offer What about all the tiny places like Kiribati, Niue and the like. Having spend time in some of those they are worth a visit for sure. Knot so much stunning scenery or old decrepit buildings but the people are just wonderful people to be around. And they can't be too bad, suss Niue. Just won the SSCA cruising station of the year award, knot at all shabby for a rock in the middle of no-where. http://www.etravelblackboard.co.nz/article.asp?id=80408 I think cruising is still highly viable and still well worth the effort but just as time changes so does the cruisers budget and/or destinations. I hope they don't try it on in the pacific. I believe Fiji now has some cruisers tax or something along those lines. Also there is the odd spot in the Pacific 'a local', usually calling themselves 'The Harbour Master' will put his hand out. Actually way back on the 1st ever thingamebob cruising rally out of NZ up to Tonga I got sort of accosted for a 'fee'. It wasn't official but it was pretty much a 'please or we may make things a tad difficult for you'. Knot money but a 6 pack was handed over, seconds later the form was stamped. It wasn't a biggie for us by any stretch (we had nearly 3 dingy loads of beverages aboard at the time) but it was pretty much only a low level version of what Italy has done. That was back in the early 90's so taxing cruisers is far from new. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 The pacific is still pretty cheap, Fiji has some petty bureaucracy but everywhere else has been pretty cool to deal with. Vanuatu is the most expensive I have experienced but it is worth it and the officials are really helpful. Futuna is by far the cheapest and easiest. Link to post Share on other sites
Grinna 2 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 As someone with both long term cruising aspirations and a desire to go back to Italy, I see the latest developments there as a bit of a blow. But .... there is a difference between the official line and reality. The Turkey situation has been mentioned briefly and officially you need cruising permits and pump-out station receipts and all sorts of palaver. In reality, its not quite that strict. I'm a little dismayed and also disturbed by what appears to be the growing trend toward charging and (more importantly) controlling cruising yachts and I guess it's only going to get worse. But if the passion to go to these places is strong enough, you'll find a way to do it I guess. It might cost more money, but maybe you end up spending less time in the pubs and restaurants, or maybe you trade skills or labour for items you want ... whatever ... if you want it enough you'll find a way. If the hassles outweigh the desire to go there, then you'll go somewhere else. There will always be those who have been out there saying "It's not like it used to be" and they may very well be right, but we'll have to see if its good enough for us. Eventually, we may run out of places to go or run out of enthusiasm and determination to overcome the bullshit, or perhaps we just have to get more creative as to how and where we visit. Who knows. It'll be fun finding out though. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 It'll be fun finding out though. Isn't that the essence of cruising? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Hey KM its a lot different just handing over a case of beers to being taxed by on high. Ones just currupt and the other is officially cururption. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 It'll be fun finding out though. Isn't that the essence of cruising? KM - Hay U - Please go cruising - but - don't go over there to Oz - "to many Ozies" well DON'T go there. They would really like you to got to all those other places - I'm sure they will welcome you & that's all really good. Don't cruise to where you have made up you fkn small mind - you wont like it - so PLEASE - don't come over HERE - as it will spoil it for everyone else - having your small minded negative sh*t in our face attitude that you go on with endlessly. All the rest of you are welcome, big time - drinks at my place 24-7-52 - - even some on the house. Ha - am sure we can sit on the roof - in the warm sunshine & enjoy many (sex) sundowners - but leave him at home PLEASE KM for Gawds sake man - get over it - Please & get on with living - to the full - a real life in the real world of today. Sometimes you come across as a total dead-sh*t. You & your tribe are still welcome for "11's es & sundowners & there ares totally on me - but give it a rest will-ya. Enjoy your weekend & go sailing - it might improve your negative attitude - for a bloody change & Gawd knows we all need that & a rest - Tnx, james Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Yes and No. In both situations if you don't front up things can become difficult, if you do that doesn't happen. I suppose the Tongan example is more what we know as Koha. A gift for services that may be rendered..... or for some that you don't want rendered. The Italy thing is just a tax like the many we all pay here..... depending on where and/or what you are doing and/or for what reason. Either way it's still the same end game. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 It'll be fun finding out though. Isn't that the essence of cruising? KM - Hay U - Please go cruising - but - don't go over there to Oz - "to many Ozies" well DON'T go there. They would really like you to got to all those other places - I'm sure they will welcome you & that's all really good. Don't cruise to where you have made up you fkn small mind - you wont like it - so PLEASE - don't come over HERE - as it will spoil it for everyone else - having your small minded negative sh*t in our face attitude that you go on with endlessly. All the rest of you are welcome, big time - drinks at my place 24-7-52 - - even some on the house. Ha - am sure we can sit on the roof - in the warm sunshine & enjoy many (sex) sundowners - but leave him at home PLEASE KM for Gawds sake man - get over it - Please & get on with living - to the full - a real life in the real world of today. Sometimes you come across as a total dead-sh*t. You & your tribe are still welcome for "11's es & sundowners & there ares totally on me - but give it a rest will-ya. Enjoy your weekend & go sailing - it might improve your negative attitude - for a bloody change & Gawd knows we all need that & a rest - Tnx, james Whhooowwww!!!!!!!! Who needs a cool tall glass of calm the f*ck down about now? I wrote I'd still like to spend a while cruising from the top of Aussie down to Tassie via the West Coast, bugger the East too many Aussies for my liking. As in "it is crowded". Do you think that I think no Aussies live on the West Coast? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Tourettes?? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Tourettes?? Female travellers who swear a lot. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Tourettes?? enjoy many (sex) sundowners Or from Gore......................... Or inland Queensland............... Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 but when someone gets off a plane we don't immediately sock them $20/day for the priviege of simply existing. We do. Ever flown into queenstown and tried to stay a week? We just pay in different ways is all. Europe and especially everything that rings the Med has for several years now, jossled and bussled with taxes and charges. Whether it be direct or indirect. A massive argument happening over there at the moment is re the "Red Fuel" tax. Even here in NZ, marinas are fast becoming a place many of us can not afford. Yet they are still full of boats. When the Marina's start to empty out, then the Owners will start thinking about the charge rates. At the moment, they are full and Capitalism is all about supply and demand. The big issue we Kiwi's have, is that our Dollar is not worth as much as some other countries and we tend to be a greater number of Cruisers on a shoe string type people. The Med and the US and a couple of other places are full of boats and owners that can and do happily pay the costs. If the Marina's are full and you can get away by charging and taxing more and still have a full marina, then that's what they do. So we Kiwi's have to find places that do not cost so much to go to. Either anchor more, or head to locations that are cheap. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Got a reply from my Italian mate. Never heard of this tax but did say it wasn't a surprises as they have loaded a gazillion new little taxes everywhere, many along the lines of the boat tax. Ones for camping here and there, doing this doing that. Many are small but they are widespread across everything. He also suggested the Italian people won't really give much of a damn as they have far bigger issues to worry about, often cruising boats are seen by many as both intrusive (as in going into some places the locals would prefer they don't), generally a game for rich pricks (does that sound familiar?) and they have other smallish taxes like this that will affect the locals more directly. He knows the Kiwi boating scene a little and said the Italian marine industry has no where near the horsepower to change Govt ideas the NZ one does. He goes on to say there are so many things going on, changes being made, new taxes being brought in or tweaked that it's likely no one actually has any solid idea just what is actually going on. In a interesting bit about cruisers pissing off some locals in some of the smaller places, he suggests there is a contingent that are seen as 'arrive, party hard causing mess and issues (drunks sleeping it off, taking a leak in doorways etc) then just bugger off'. The locals can feel like they are being a bit used and abused. An interesting comment and one I've also heard in the odd spot in the Sth Pacific as well. He didn't mention any specific type of cruiser in that used and abused bit but one would think that it's most likely the charter fleet mob rather than the hard core long term bunch. Same sort of deal with the comments I've heard in the Sth Pac, the few issues seemed to be caused more by the the pop up 1 or 2 month cruising and then fire back home mob rather than the hard core longer term cruisers, who do tend to be very 'locals friendly' as a rule. Is it 'Aussies' or 'Ozies'? I would have thought 'Aussies' is the right one seeing they do generally live in Australia rather than Oztralia. Always wondered a little about that. Oztralia does sound like a good name for a trailer manufacturer though. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Yes but here's a good place to cruise and so is Aus but you'll have to get permission from the Oz immigration minister, thats the Silver Raven. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Hey, I can write in a ambiguous ways at times, unintentionally most of them..... but knot all , so be gentle on SR as he probably hasn't figured that bit out just yet. One day he'll see me take a swipe at the Aussies and will then realise there will be no confusion as to my meaning. The gist was the West Coast is a hell less busy with people than the East, for me that is good. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Top end of the west coast would be unreal. Link to post Share on other sites
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