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Another reason for Dalts to quit....


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Dalton made a very good point at a sponsors evening I attended before the last cup. He said to us:

 

'If you can't get a face to face meeting with the key figure in a company you'd like to do business with, invite them to our base during the AC. Because unlike the All Blacks or the Silver Ferns or Formula 1, no one has ever turned down an invite to ride with ETNZ'

 

That's where ETNZ was such an effective tool for NZ business. It was the link between NZ business and the rest of the world. Because if you asked, the person you wanted to meet would ALWAYS come. That scenario played out thousands of times during the last campaign. That's why the benefit to NZ was so great.

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Dalton made a very good point at a sponsors evening I attended before the last cup. He said to us:

 

'If you can't get a face to face meeting with the key figure in a company you'd like to do business with, invite them to our base during the AC. Because unlike the All Blacks or the Silver Ferns or Formula 1, no one has ever turned down an invite to ride with ETNZ'

 

That's where ETNZ was such an effective tool for NZ business. It was the link between NZ business and the rest of the world. Because if you asked, the person you wanted to meet would ALWAYS come. That scenario played out thousands of times during the last campaign. That's why the benefit to NZ was so great.

 

If that is the case, and seeing the two foiling cats wrapped in plastic in their yard at the viaduct, ...

 

Why? Don't they put them together and invite sponsors down for a weekend blasting around the harbour.

 

Some people would pay good money to do 45 knots on a cat.

 

Dalton is stale and need a new focus.

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Dalton is stale and need a new focus.

 

I'd say its Sailor X who needs a new focus. Team NZ wouldn't have survived the drought after the 2007 cup without Dalts. Give it a rest!

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Dalton is stale and need a new focus.

 

I'd say its Sailor X who is stale and needs a new focus.

..and ypur thoughts on the rest of my post?.....

 

No?....

 

 

Nothing..?...

 

:roll:

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Dalton made a very good point at a sponsors evening I attended before the last cup. He said to us:

 

'If you can't get a face to face meeting with the key figure in a company you'd like to do business with, invite them to our base during the AC. Because unlike the All Blacks or the Silver Ferns or Formula 1, no one has ever turned down an invite to ride with ETNZ'

 

Believe that and you will almost believe anything. Who saw, witness ETNZ 1000's on time with non sailors on board whilst trialling their boats on the HG and SF harbour..

 

That's where ETNZ was such an effective tool for NZ business. It was the link between NZ business and the rest of the world. Because if you asked, the person you wanted to meet would ALWAYS come. That scenario played out thousands of times during the last campaign. That's why the benefit to NZ was so great.

 

If that is the case, and seeing the two foiling cats wrapped in plastic in their yard at the viaduct, ...

 

 

 

Why? Don't they put them together and invite sponsors down for a weekend blasting around the harbour.

 

Some people would pay good money to do 45 knots on a cat.

 

Dalton is stale and need a new focus.

 

Dalton has stated on record they are valueless.

 

Question Sailor X ?

 

What would be the situation if they used them to two boat test assuming they get to be a competitor?

 

The new protocol states they are not to trial compare, but nothing about the old boats.

 

Oracle has shackled themselves with a clause, latest protocol, they can't sail both their boats at the same time.

 

The challengers where offered the choice to have second boats with the same clause as the defender but The challenger on record and possible others rejected the offer on costs saving grounds.

 

It has already been pointed at the saving costs is a red hearing. All they had to do was revert to soft sails and allow modifications to the existing boats. The expert designer said there would be very little speed difference do away with a crane, about 60 crew / staff members, a hanger like shed and allow a stored power servo to control the boards which would allow the fix boards to become powered forward moving boards to compensate for balance, safety when flying a gennaker.

 

Also with the old rules he floated power winches to reduce costs even further, but received calls from the high paid crew professionals they would become unemployed and expressed loudly disapproval.

 

The whole time he was being vetoed by a ORACLE designer even to the extent restricting stored power for 2 mins for the servo. He gave an example the ETNZ almost capsize would have been avoided. He tried to argue on the name on safety and saving the boats plus allowing the boats to sail at greater wind speeds, which would have been an viewer / crowd pleaser advantage.

 

 

They are allowed two promotional boats at the next venue with restrictions. They refer to them with another title.

 

When they fold the gov't has no covenant on the boats, which the gov't should have. The bank would.

 

Just as you have suggested another syndicate would find them valuable to raise funds where ever for the richies to tell their fellow sailors /club members / neighbours they have sailed on them with a smug look on their faces.

 

Additional Poll

 

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=24504

 

OC

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Additionally.

 

 

Dalton has been on the role for over a decade now and whether it's business or when you look at sporting teams, the most important thing you judge a team on are results. Spithill also thinks so. So does the Prime Minister.

 

Team NZ has become a business and they do not believe or have not heard about working on overtime with no pay.

 

Spithill has named the follow as his pick who should replace team NZ.

 

 

 

Brad Butterworth, Murray Jones, Simon Daubney, Mike Drummond, Warwick Fleury, all former America's Cup winners, as candidates to replace Dalton.

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Just because they have won a cup before (and I'm not knocking that at all, it's very difficult) does not mean they are suitable as team managers....

Anyone thought that SH might be trying to get rid of a threat for next time already?

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Just because they have won a cup before (and I'm not knocking that at all, it's very difficult) does not mean they are suitable as team managers....

Anyone thought that SH might be trying to get rid of a threat for next time already?

 

Very interesting. Lets look back...

 

Russ coutts - TNZ, Alingi and Oracle winner/GM /CEO

 

Peter Blake. TNZ, Whitbread winner and many offshore records- CEO

 

Dalton - AC loser whitbread winner

 

Chris Dickson, no whitbread, no Volvo, no Olympic medal, no AC, CEO Tag Heur, manager Japan Team

 

Its favouring winners so far. ( in favour of winners make good GM's)

 

Without being a "sailing High" /OC I think you will find that every previous Manager/CEO has a great winning/sailing background right back to Warren Jones and Australia 2.

 

Even back in the seventies the managers/CEO's were winners.

 

Winners are winners.

 

Sorry I think it helps to have come from a winning team/culture/ ... but its not a 100% fact maybe 80/20

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Just because they have won a cup before (and I'm not knocking that at all, it's very difficult) does not mean they are suitable as team managers....

Anyone thought that SH might be trying to get rid of a threat for next time already?

 

Very interesting. Lets look back...

 

Russ coutts - TNZ, Alingi and Oracle winner/GM /CEO

 

Peter Blake. TNZ, Whitbread winner and many offshore records- CEO

 

Dalton - AC loser whitbread winner

 

Chris Dickson, no whitbread, no Volvo, no Olympic medal, no AC, CEO Tag Heur, manager Japan Team

 

Its favouring winners so far. ( in favour of winners make good GM's)

 

Without being a "sailing High" /OC I think you will find that every previous Manager/CEO has a great winning/sailing background right back to Warren Jones and Australia 2.

 

Even back in the seventies the managers/CEO's were winners.

 

Winners are winners.

 

Sorry I think it helps to have come from a winning team/culture/ ... but its not a 100% fact maybe 80/20

 

SX I think you are being extremely unfair on Chris.

 

Dickson sailed from an early age, starting out in the Sabot and P Class boats, before graduating to Lasers and 470s. In 1977 he won both the Tanner Cup and Tauranga Cup for P Class events with a perfect zero points score in both.

 

By the time he turned 15 he had won every regatta possible, from match racing between clubs to provincial and national championships.

 

Chris. He was world youth champion three years in succession and later became world match race champion three times and numerous other match races winner.

 

As skipper of Tokio he looked set to win the W60 class in the 1993-94 Whitbread Round the World race until the boat was dismasted in the fifth leg.

 

Plus Larry Ellison's 78 foot maxi yacht Sayonara to line honours in the 1998 Sydney to Hobart Yacht Race and with four world championship regattas.

 

1987: skipper of Kiwi Magic (KZ 7) PERTH FREEMANTEL AUS challenger entrant, finished second in the Louis Vuitton Cup with at that time the highest number on consecutive wins America's Loui V Cup. Won every race except the last. He begged the cheque book holder to alter the boat / make it lighter but for the now long forgotten QUOTE "WHY CHANGE A WINNING FORMULAR" by The then Merchant banker.

 

The Loui V [ DC ] winner went on the beat Australia easily and win the cup for USA.

 

The boat at the time was a revolution. Remember the famous miss quote "Why would any body build a yacht with Glass when every body else uses aluminium, unless you wanted to CHEAT."

 

He returned to NZ and was chastised / slammed dunked as a unreasonable person and forced to go overseas for employment.

Chris B and Chris D where the two yachtsman [ my opinion ] that got the NZ public interested / fascinated with Big yacht racing / International yacht racing.

 

In the 1987 Queen's Birthday Honours, Dickson was appointed a Member of the Order of the British Empire, for services to yachting.

 

Dickson, 2007 had become one of the highest paid sailors in the world

 

SH

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Spithill has named the follow as his pick who should replace team NZ.
Jimmy's only had to rock up and follow some numbers on a ipad while his sugar daddies organised and paid for everything. Daltons had to work to get where he is. Just ignore him and listen to people who have been there done that.
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Just because they have won a cup before (and I'm not knocking that at all, it's very difficult) does not mean they are suitable as team managers....

Anyone thought that SH might be trying to get rid of a threat for next time already?

 

Very interesting. Lets look back...

 

Russ coutts - TNZ, Alingi and Oracle winner/GM /CEO

 

Peter Blake. TNZ, Whitbread winner and many offshore records- CEO

 

Dalton - AC loser whitbread winner

 

Chris Dickson, no whitbread, no Volvo, no Olympic medal, no AC, CEO Tag Heur, manager Japan Team

 

Its favouring winners so far. ( in favour of winners make good GM's)

 

Without being a "sailing High" /OC I think you will find that every previous Manager/CEO has a great winning/sailing background right back to Warren Jones and Australia 2.

 

Even back in the seventies the managers/CEO's were winners.

 

Winners are winners.

 

Sorry I think it helps to have come from a winning team/culture/ ... but its not a 100% fact maybe 80/20

 

SX I think you are being extremely unfair on Chris.

 

Dickson sailed from an early age, starting out in the Sabot and P Class boats, before graduating to Lasers and 470s. In 1977 he won both the Tanner Cup and Tauranga Cup for P Class events with a perfect zero points score in both.

 

By the time he turned 15 he had won every regatta possible, from match racing between clubs to provincial and national championships.

 

Chris. He was world youth champion three years in succession and later became world match race champion three times and numerous other match races winner.

 

As skipper of Tokio he looked set to win the W60 class in the 1993-94 Whitbread Round the World race until the boat was dismasted in the fifth leg.

 

Plus Larry Ellison's 78 foot maxi yacht Sayonara to line honours in the 1998 Sydney to Hobart Yacht Race and with four world championship regattas.

 

1987: skipper of Kiwi Magic (KZ 7) PERTH FREEMANTEL AUS challenger entrant, finished second in the Louis Vuitton Cup with at that time the highest number on consecutive wins America's Loui V Cup. Won every race except the last. He begged the cheque book holder to alter the boat / make it lighter but for the now long forgotten QUOTE "WHY CHANGE A WINNING FORMULAR" by The then Merchant banker.

 

The Loui V [ DC ] winner went on the beat Australia easily and win the cup for USA.

 

The boat at the time was a revolution. Remember the famous miss quote "Why would any body build a yacht with Glass when every body else uses aluminium, unless you wanted to CHEAT."

 

He returned to NZ and was chastised / slammed dunked as a unreasonable person and forced to go overseas for employment.

Chris B and Chris D where the two yachtsman [ my opinion ] that got the NZ public interested / fascinated with Big yacht racing / International yacht racing.

 

In the 1987 Queen's Birthday Honours, Dickson was appointed a Member of the Order of the British Empire, for services to yachting.

 

Dickson, 2007 had become one of the highest paid sailors in the world

 

SH

 

The facts are the facts SH. He also never won a world champs in any class at the senior level.

 

See the similarity with Dean Barker. Youth champs and match racing champs wins and a few placings in the AC

 

chris was / may still be the most overpaid failure in yachting. dean may be second.

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Dixon got screwed over badly. That is a big blight in NZ's AC history.

 

To lump that pressure on a young fella then slag the crap out of him as damn near the soul reason NZ lost was just so so wrong.

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Dixon got screwed over badly. That is a big blight in NZ's AC history.

 

To lump that pressure on a young fella then slag the crap out of him as damn near the soul reason NZ lost was just so so wrong.

 

 

Oh come on Knotty. Dickson was a cocky gun Slinger who could not be contained and demanded far to much.

 

Fay gave him his head and he had more hip thrusting ego boasting than captain flash heart on Black adder.

 

He was given the better crew ahead of Woody on KZ3 and he talked up his chances beyond reality.

 

He was always a pushy prick even when protesting David Barnes in the 470 trials because he got dorked and could not handle it.

 

Dicko got back a lot less that he gave.

 

He was never blamed for losing but was made to look and idiot when he tried to out fox Big Den on the big AC stage.

Sorry mate but no sympathy for Di:cko here .

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SX Quote "Plus Larry Ellison's 78 foot maxi yacht Sayonara to line honours in the 1998 Sydney to Hobart Yacht Race and with four world championship regattas."

 

You don't regard World Championships Regattas as What ....

 

He won those After the AC KZ 7 commission.

 

SL Opinion only.

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Spithill has named the follow as his pick who should replace team NZ.
Jimmy's only had to rock up and follow some numbers on a ipad while his sugar daddies organised and paid for everything. Daltons had to work to get where he is. Just ignore him and listen to people who have been there done that.

 

 

Brad Butterworth, Murray Jones, Simon Daubney, Warwick Fleury.

 

Try telling them they have not had to work where they are at 2014.

 

OC.

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SX Quote "Plus Larry Ellison's 78 foot maxi yacht Sayonara to line honours in the 1998 Sydney to Hobart Yacht Race and with four world championship regattas."

 

You don't regard World Championships Regattas as What ....

 

He won those After the AC KZ 7 commission.

 

SL Opinion only.

I think you will find the boat won that regatta more than the helmsman. Sayonara was so far advanced in the competition.

 

Dickos results to income ratio is the most ridiculous in world sport. Barkers chasing him hard though and Rod Davis, has

S got to in the top 5.

 

Having said that Spithill has done naf all other than AC.... but at least he has won that.

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This post tried to degenerate into a slanging match. I won't have that. More of it and I'll lock the thread.

 

Users concerned have been warned. PLEASE people keep it friendly. You are free to disagree with each other, provided it is done in a polite manner. Personal attacks, including sarcastic ones, will not be tolerated. If a post offends you in any way, please press the "report post" button and let me or one of the other moderators deal with it. If you reply in kind, you are likely to get the same penalty as the original poster. You have been warned. PLAY NICE!

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SX Quote "Plus Larry Ellison's 78 foot maxi yacht Sayonara to line honours in the 1998 Sydney to Hobart Yacht Race and with four world championship regattas."

 

You don't regard World Championships Regattas as What ....

 

He won those After the AC KZ 7 commission.

 

SL Opinion only.

I think you will find the boat won that regatta more than the helmsman. Sayonara was so far advanced in the competition.

 

Dickos results to income ratio is the most ridiculous in world sport. Barkers chasing him hard though and Rod Davis, has

S got to in the top 5.

 

Having said that Spithill has done naf all other than AC.... but at least he has won that.

 

Spithill was the helmsman for Allinghi also.

OCX

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My apologies to all for previous comments!

 

Moving forward...I think Dicko did exceedingly well on Tag considering it was a one boat campaign that was under funded from the go. If the Whitbread was like it is now on a point scoring system rather than an elapsed time system he would have one on Tokio. Toshiba also broke a 24/hr record too.

 

I think Dalts is the man for rasing money so has his place in ETNZ but someone else needs to be the driving force to help them win.....if the rules where fairer...which they dont seem to be!!

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