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Dulux Super Enamel V Toplac for above waterline


Zozza

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The Dulux Super Enamel is more or less half the price of the Toplac, and I gather you can mix the Dulux to almost any colour.

So, any reason I should pay more for the "Marine" paint over the Dulux? Durability issues?

I am sure this has come up before, but the search function on this site is now sh*t, in a word.

Cheers

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Toplac is no ordinary Enamel. It is a Silicon Alkyd Enamel and will last twice as long as a standard polymer enamel like Dulux

 

Thanks Wheels.

Twice price, twice as long before repaint?....I guess then the extra couple hundred $ might well be worth it.

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Ok thanks guys. Any reason I could not use 3 parts of the colour I want-cream- but with 1 part white to make it the pale cream colour I am after? No issues doing this with this Toplac product?

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Mixing Toplac with Toplac is not problem at all.

 

Although I can't say for sure and so don't take this as solid advice, but I really can't see a problem with using standard Tints in Toplac, so there should be no reason why a Paint shop couldn't tint Toplac to give a colour outside of the standard ranges.

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Mixing Toplac with Toplac is not problem at all.

 

Although I can't say for sure and so don't take this as solid advice, but I really can't see a problem with using standard Tints in Toplac, so there should be no reason why a Paint shop couldn't tint Toplac to give a colour outside of the standard ranges.

 

 

Thanks Wheels,

I phoned the importers of Toplac last week, and they don't mix or tint.

What paint shops are you referring to?

Seems only the chain chandlers (Burnsco, Smart Marine etc) sell this Toplac stuff, up here in Auckland at least.

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Another question at the risk of turning this into 'Boatpainting 101', my current topcoat is in good condition, so I apparently just need to sand it enough to "take the polish off" before given it a couple coats of the new colour I desire.

 

But to take the "polish off" of the current topcoat, I have read and been told to use anywhere from120 grit, to 150-180 grit by different people, and then looking at the Toplac product guide, they advise the folowing:

 

PREVIOUSLY PAINTED SURFACE:

In Good Condition: Wash down with a suitable detergent, rinse with fresh water and allow to dry. Abrade with 280-320 grade (grit) paper.

 

You can see how a lad can get confused! What do you guys reckon?

 

And lastly, once I figure all the above prep out, and finally apply the first top coat, is it worth giving it a sand in between coats?

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The Importers do that only...import and distribute. Forget the Burnsco's and anyone selling Cans off shelf's. You need a proper Paint specialist. Wairua Paint Centre would be the go I reckon. 90 Wairau Rd, Glenfield. They would at least have the expertise to tell you if there is any problem using a standard Tint in Toplac. The main thing is they will want a "recipe". So you would need to grab a colour chart and pick a shade of what you want. They can then make it up to fit that colour/shade. Very few will have a go at just tinting with nothing to go on. it also helps repeatability. It means you can get the same shade if you run short or ever need a touch up.

 

As for the painting, Always go for what the Manufacturer suggests. You shouldn't need to sand between coats unless some pesky insect gets on the surface.

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The Importers do that only...import and distribute. Forget the Burnsco's and anyone selling Cans off shelf's. You need a proper Paint specialist. Wairua Paint Centre would be the go I reckon. 90 Wairau Rd, Glenfield. They would at least have the expertise to tell you if there is any problem using a standard Tint in Toplac. The main thing is they will want a "recipe". So you would need to grab a colour chart and pick a shade of what you want. They can then make it up to fit that colour/shade. Very few will have a go at just tinting with nothing to go on. it also helps repeatability. It means you can get the same shade if you run short or ever need a touch up.

 

As for the painting, Always go for what the Manufacturer suggests. You shouldn't need to sand between coats unless some pesky insect gets on the surface.

 

Okay I will contact the Wairau place, thanks mate.

As for following manufacturers guidelines re sanding - will do. Don't understand why there would be so many differing opinions on what to grit sandpaper to use on a previously painted hull in good condition - so yep, just sticking with what Int Paints advise makes sense.

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As for following manufacturers guidelines re sanding - will do. Don't understand why there would be so many differing opinions on what to grit sandpaper to use on a previously painted hull in good condition - so yep, just sticking with what Int Paints advise makes sense.

If you are undercoating, then a 120-180 is what you want to create a key and then you presand with a 280 or so before the Top coat to ensure all dust particles are removed. I will not advise here because I haven't had a lot to do with Toplac yet. Normally, you would undercoat before applying a Top coat, most especially if the old Topcoat is not the same type as the New one. I understand that Toplac can be overcoated with itself, but I don't know what is required with old different paint. So make sure you read the Manufacturers advice/requirements on that. It also on the quality of the old paint as well. Heavily oxidized old paint needs the oxidized layer removed. Any unsound paint needs to be removed and edges feathered. Bare Base material needs to be primed and undercoated.

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Mixing Toplac with Toplac is not problem at all.

 

Although I can't say for sure and so don't take this as solid advice, but I really can't see a problem with using standard Tints in Toplac, so there should be no reason why a Paint shop couldn't tint Toplac to give a colour outside of the standard ranges.

 

 

Thanks Wheels,

I phoned the importers of Toplac last week, and they don't mix or tint.

What paint shops are you referring to?

Seems only the chain chandlers (Burnsco, Smart Marine etc) sell this Toplac stuff, up here in Auckland at least.

Bunnings sell it and if you point out the smart marine member price, they will 'beat it by 15%'.

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I switched to using automotive paints years ago and popular choices were the Lusteroid two pots Caprithane and Superthane, My favourite was always Dulux Dulon. An Epiglass rep that used to come into my place of work told me that I was making a big mistake using automotive paints as they were too brittle. (Obviously he had a vested interest in giving me that advice.)

I used to do some fiberglass repairs at my brother inlaw's panel shop and got to see a lot of damaged cars coming through. In most cases you would see a panel pushed in but unless there had been impact damage in the immediate area the rest of the paint was still attached to the panel. If those panels had been painted with Epithane or Reaction Laquer the paint would have flaked off in sheets. I sprayed a friends boat in Lusteroid Caprithane and soon after used Dulon on my own boat. Admittedly the boats were painted in light colours but ten years later after having a polish both boats still looked like they had just been painted.

The boats were painted for one third of the cost of using the then popular Epiglass two pots.

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Hang about Dusty, Caprithane and Superthane are not standard every day car paints. They are specialised high performance paints and there is very little difference between Caprithane and Epithane, Superthane and Reaction Lacquer. If you painted a car in the Epithane or Reaction lacquer, you would have found a similar performance on a Car panel. Although a normal bog standard every day Car is painted in a single pot Nitrocellulose Lacquer, not two component high performance urathane coatings.

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Hang about Dusty, Caprithane and Superthane are not standard every day car paints. They are specialised high performance paints and there is very little difference between Caprithane and Epithane, Superthane and Reaction Lacquer. If you painted a car in the Epithane or Reaction lacquer, you would have found a similar performance on a Car panel. Although a normal bog standard every day Car is painted in a single pot Nitrocellulose Lacquer, not two component high performance urathane coatings.

I have seen a number of cars painted with Reaction Lacquer and all suffered the same problems chipping and flaking paint

Yes there was very little difference in performance but the biggest difference was the price and the Lusteroid/Dulux paints appeared to be able to take a lot more flexing of the material they were attached to than what the Epiglass products would. As far as temperatures go Air NZ used Caprithane in the days of flying the DC10's and early 747's and these regularly suffered temps of -65C to +45C.

Dulux Dulon was probably the most popular automotive paint used in the 1970's to late 1980's when the switch to oven baked enamels in the automotive industry started. Dulon was a single pot modified acrylic laquer, very user friendly and very quick drying. My own boat showed that even Dulon had the potential to last as long as the Epiglass two pots for a fraction of the cost.

The truth of the matter is that we as boat owners have been ripped off for years by paint companies with so called specialist marine paints and as I said using these paints I.E. Caprithane, Superthane and Dulon was about one third of the cost of using the Epithane/Reaction Lacquer products

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I tried Dulux super enamel on my kids Opti about ten years ago. It fell off before the end of the season. Repainted it with TOPLAC and had no further problems. I have also had white Toplac tinted to match the tan deck colour of an old laser. The colour chart match recipe didn't work so the paint shop guy used the same tint recipe but increased the tinter dose to obtain the desired colour. It took several times the recommended quantity of tinter to achieve the desired colour for the quantity of white paint used. Whether the extra tinter will affect to the life of the paint I don't know. It has has been on the laser stored outside for about 4 years now and is as good as new. I have never had any problem mixing different colours of Toplac together. I mix a little turps to the Toplac when brushing which helps it flow out better. On a vertical surface you must apply it very thinly or it will sag. You need to work very quickly to keep a wet edge so the brush marks will flow out. After about a week of drying I very lightly wet sand it with 400 grit, just enough to get the dust off and after a few days further drying I polish it with any good polish and it ends up looking like a spray job.

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