Westhaven - Shore power leads

[Absolution 7]

Has anyone else read the flyer that came out from Westhaven last week which included the update on shore power leads? It basically says that you can no-longer connect to shore power unless you have proper 240V installation in the boat and that the current practice of using an extension cord to supply a single device is no longer allowed.

 

WTF? That is a complete pain in the ass. I can’t see many yacht owners wanting to add 240V distribution boards and wiring to their boats. Seems over the top to me. Anyone out there know if they are correctly interpreting the “new” regs or has some poetic license been taken here…?

[Guest]

I've heard the same in Bayswater. I think someone mush something wrong, that is just lunacy otherwise.

[Farrari 4]

Pine Harbour were threatening to do the same thing before I moved to HMB.

[Murky 1]

Yet another one of those situations when you can't envisage what problem this was the solution to. It's not like there are two or three boats blowing up each week because they had a dehumid running.

[Guest]

perhaps you should ask a local saior "sherm" what happens when boats have dodgy power hook ups. He had to be kick started twice and it still affects him today.

 

You can't hook your caravan up to a campsite power board without the proper leads and certs.

[Murky 1]

The original post says:

you can no-longer connect to shore power unless you have proper 240V installation in the boat and that the current practice of using an extension cord to supply a single device is no longer allowed.

which I took to mean more than "proper leads and certs".

 

Sorry about Sherm, whoever he may be. Didn't intend to indicate that it wasn't a major when it happens - but that it is not something, to my knowledge, that takes place on a frequent basis.

[Guest]

Sorry about Sherm...but probably he had a 240V circuit on the boat and not just a extension cable with a trickle charger or a dehumid attached. Plug boxes have fuses and the power point has an earth leakage(?).

 

If Westhaven want to make it safer then they should have power points on both sides of a finger so that leads do not have to be run across it.

 

I have just got the new electrical warrant infomation with the berth rate increase plus increase in GST notice. I might just have to get a second mortgage to fund mooring costs (plus the fine for not being electrically compliant).

[Guest]

I went into Westhaven Office earlier this week and had a wee go at the poor office staff.

 

What a utter waste of time their notice was.

 

They ladies gave me the name of Tony Murray to have a chat with. Although the article was a waste of time and uninformative on how to go about getting things up to the new law.....on the phone he was quite helpful.

 

To get a unit installed on Smokey Joe to Supply shore power legally now- Effectively a new lead and plug, and a 3 pin plug installed on SJ- costs about $350 odd.

 

This was to include a new 4 year E-WOF.

 

So more $$$ but not the end of the world.....but more $ that we all probably think we shouldn't have to spend.

 

I for one am constantly disapointed with the constant waste of money for "management" that westhaven/ Auckland city council.

 

Maybe thats a new thread we could start....ways Westhaven could become more efficient so they could lower the fees they charge us.....??!!!

[Guest]

Yeap, it's true, I've been a sussing. As of April 1st (coincidence????) 'non-fixed' but safe as anyway, is knot allowed. They are allowing a 'phase in' period.

This applies to every single Marina in NZ.

 

Basically you have to have a fully fixed to the boat, in a permanent way, a 240V panel. That panel will have to have the whotsits to drop the 16Amp supply (all marinas have gone or are going 16Amp) down to 10 Amps. A breaker thingy and a plug... or more maybe is allowed. This applies if you want to run ANYTHING WHAT SO EVER 240V on or in your boat while in a NZ Marina. That includes dehumidifies, a battery charger, a vacuum cleaner or the wifes dildo.

 

Basically if you have an 'approved' extension cord with the goodies box on the boat end, you can screw that goodies box to the boat and you're good to go. Sadly when the boat leaves the marina that now will mean the extension cord you left in you car now has to come for the ride.

 

Also the 4 or 5 (??) yearly electrical inspections are dropping to 12 monthly inspections.

 

It also sounds like running an extension lead for only a 10min tweak one arvo will knot be allowed. The full noise or no noise at all seems to be the new programme.

 

Apparently the whole system is now 'safety focused' (wasn't it before???) due to so many boats blowing up and the 30 people getting fried each day...... {insert Tui ad here}

 

So there ya go, Yes bureaucracy has invented yet another non-existing issue but don't panic, they have solved it as well

[wheels 543]

12montly? I didn't know that. That is just stupiud rediculous and not to mention stupid expensive.

[smithy09 50]

That is just f&^#(n stupid. 16A down to 10A means nothing. I can understand them saying that your extension lead had to have an electrical WOF and be fitted with an RCCB (Earth leakage breaker) but that is all that is required, nothing more. A perminant sub board on your boat is just rediculous, and won't make them any safer at all. I would love to see what part of the electrical regs they are pointing at....

Dumb dumb dumb.

[Murky 1]

Basically if you have an 'approved' extension cord with the goodies box on the boat end, you can screw that goodies box to the boat and you're good to go

And that box is safer installed and travelling somewhere within a 30ft boat, with the accompanying risk of salt spray/water coming down the hatch with sails etc, than it was left in the car park? Oops there goes another Tui ad

[Guest]

Murky - perhaps read between KM's lines....

[wheels 543]

I don't think any box has to be attached as such. If that is the case, then it brings in another issue the powers that be haven't thought of and that is a flexible cable can no longer be used. Permanent install means you have to use install cable, or that white flat looking stuff with the three seperate conductors inside that we call TPS/ Twin and earth.

Smithy, it is not dropping 16A to 10A, it is having a 10A breaker to protect the lead back to the 16A breaker on the marina.

Get used to it folks. It's all about covering butts now. If someone doesn't have the correct set up, their insurance company will have an out. If the Marina has not taken the same steps, their insurance will also be in jepordy also.

 

Here's how hard insurance is getting. A mate has Public liability insurance, like all of us are supposed to have when running our own business. Well he made a mistake the other day on a expensive hydraulic pump. A real simple mistake and anyone could have done it, nothing idiot wise. The $5K pump failed and he thought oh darn but at least I have insurance. Well no actually. The Insurance company turned around and said, no we don't cover this as this is considered incompetance, not an accident.

So if you are working on someones boat and you forgot to tighten up a Skin fitting and the boat sinks, guess what, that is not an accedent now. That is incompetence and you are not covered by Insurance.

[Guest]

The Regs are the ones used for Caravans, boats are now treated exactly the same and use the exact same Reg.

 

The 'goodies box' will have to be IP67, whatever it is number, approved i.e. water proof. (You'd hope Navman don't get into this )

 

Shame about the plug on the other end that will end up being pushed under cockpits, into the bilge or wherever to get it out of the way while racing, to get covered in/ full of water and rot away though

 

Someone just told me an 'Electrical wiring check' on something like this is around $90.

 

It looks like existing systems, that are legal and currently in WOF, are fine but when they come up for the next WOF they must conform to the new system. That, my darlings, seems to be the grace period being mentioned.

 

I have one of the old ones that was new at the time (all 3.5 years old ) which has the goodies screwed onto a nice bit of Plywood. I will have to change to a box thing like they screw into the side of a house to comply with the waterproof bit. The newer leads I've seen do tend to have the box with the goodies in that these days, those box types should be good to go.

 

Shame I'll have to lose a berth to fit it in, will probably have crew tripping over the lead hurting themselves, the plugs shredding sails and a few other good things but as we all know the bureaucrats obviously don't sail so why should they care.

 

Yes Mr Wheels, you WILL have to have a box attached in a permanent* manner. They showed me exactly what they will now require and being a tight arsed and sometimes stroppy yachtie I immediately went hunting for loopholes. None found as yet......but it is early days

 

* - The box they showed me for 1 outlet plug was about 100mm square and 300mm high. When asked 'So as I only use if for a dehumidifier during winter, when summer comes and I take that off I can also take the power box/lead off?' The answer was a definite 'No'. How they will know that when I DO DO just that I'm knot sure.

[wheels 543]

Hmmm, interesting, because the Marinas here are selling a box with four sockets. A kind of Super grade Multi box thing. The price is $249.00. So that would mean that they are selling the wrong thing then. And it is not IP67. Umm are you sure it has to be 67? because that means full imersion proof. The caravan plug is available with a cap by the way, so it can be kept clean and dry when not in use.

The inspection on my boat was valid for just three years and it cost me $150 when i last got it. It has now run out and I was told the new inspection was up around the $200 mark.

[Guest]

Knot sure what number it was bar a IP something but the phrase 'to make sure the guts stay dry' was used.

 

Last Simrad race being IP67 probably wasn't a bad call

 

I'm guessing there is a range of boxes (enclosures) that could be used, I just asked what's the smallest I can get away with and was shown the one outlet version.

 

I also suspect the marinas know they will get some feedback on this and it won't be good. Maybe they are using the gently does it approach at this stage.

 

There must be a Regoed Sparkie here to give us the ins and outs.

[Farrari 4]

I'm knot sure what the arrangement is at other marina's but I had the impression at Half Moon Bay you needed a metered power outlet per berth if you are going to connect to a permanent 230V supply.

 

I am feeling the need for a semi portable eco house equivalent to run a 230v dehumidifier via an inverter. Perhaps even a 12v dehumidifier might be the go if I can find one.

 

I'm really not keen to have a permanent connection mount on the boat. I could see that being far more hassle than it's worth.

[Guest]

I should have mentioned before..

 

I was advised that a 4 year eWOF could be issued for getting the Job that Tony Murray advised I'd need.

 

His number if anyone wants to contact him is 021 930344

 

Guess I better get onto it...there might be a bit of a queue about to form for getting these things installed!

 

The way the Marina has advised about all this is coming into force has been appalling.

If they had done it in a more measured and informative way- we might all be a little less hostile.

 

It's frustrating having things thrust upon you without time to prepare or look at alternatives.

Toles

[Norwegian Blue 10]

I spoke to Tony the week before last because the marina office were after an EWOF, which confused me as I only have 12v. Anyway, as he confirmed, I don't need one. He did say that if I wanted to run a dehumidifier all winter that I would have to have a permanent 230v setup. But I asked about using a lead for the odd bit of maintenance (power tools - drill, sander etc) and he said that would be OK if it was with an approved lead which he had offered to make up for the marina so that we could borrow as needed. Needless to say, they haven't gone rushing back to accept the offer.

 

The wording does say portable appliance. Do you think power tools will be exempt?