Fogg 427 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 25 minutes ago, Black Panther said: From Facebook this morning https://www.facebook.com/groups/184759482871196/permalink/229907528356391/ Not on FB. What does it say? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Panther 1,568 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 Several hundred offshore cruisers in the Eastern Pacific worried they will need to escape cyclone season come October November. But this years class won't be leaving. So pressure on facilities even if they are allowed in . Im sure a lot of marine businesses in the north will want them here. Also another report of a boat literally wandering western Indian Ocean and Red sea trying to find a place to go. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 4 hours ago, bigal.nz said: I would talk to both HM and Police Maritime unit. After you have filled with water they may put restrictions on how far you can then go (nearest safe anchorage). I have heard reports that those coming back from the barrier are not allowed to go out again. Good point, I don't want to spend the next month tied up to the fuel dock in GH! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,211 Posted April 16, 2020 Author Share Posted April 16, 2020 No one is there, and several liveaboards have come in, refueled and left again. It wont be a problem, just come in when you are ready. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 sh*t hot, thanks IT Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,211 Posted April 17, 2020 Author Share Posted April 17, 2020 Plus I just checked with my neighbor, Police maritime unit. No problem for a liveaboard... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted April 17, 2020 Share Posted April 17, 2020 Awesome, thanks so much for that! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Panther 1,568 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 https://www.yachtmollymawk.com/2020/04/stay-right-where-you-are/ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 Successfully battled nearly 8 knot winds chugging around to GH yesterday for a fuel/water fill. No stone throwing locals observed. Quite odd around Tiri Passage and not seeing a boat anywhere... Did observe one ~40 foot motorist anchored at the entrance to Mahurangi (fishing). Didn't think that was in the spirit of lockdown. Funnily I could not see any name on the boat, almost as if he knew he was being naughty and didn't want to be reported.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Winter 42 Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 From Bailys Is your boat covered by insurance, if being used during the Covid-19 Level 3 & 4 Lockdown? If you use your boat, having been told by the Government that you shouldn't, then the short answer is "No". It would be regarded as a reckless act and/or wilful misconduct, and your pleasure craft insurance policy contains an exclusion for that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Deep Purple 511 Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 I assume then they are issuing credits on insurance? My aircraft insurer did automatically putting all non-commercial planes on ground risks only for a month 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 "Is your boat covered by insurance, if being used during the Covid-19 Level 3 & 4 Lockdown?" Coincidentally, just been through some hoops with Baileys, who have communicated very effectively and quickly during lockdown. I needed to renew my policy, fortunately they checked when I mentioned we live aboard and cruise around - discovered that I had not actually been insured for the last 3 years as the underwriter had changed, along with the policy. The new policy (that I didn't even have a copy of) said no cover for liveaboards. I had specified exactly what our plans were when we insured with them originally so slightly dismayed at all this... Got it tidied up - basically living aboard puts you in a high-risk category that attracts a higher premium. No surprises there. The new email from them will mean that I will have to check to see if all the $$$$$ that I have paid are of any value. If I find that I am not insured I might just say F'k it and go and do what we need to do, which is get on a mooring on Barrier for the winter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Panther 1,568 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 Fascinating they think being a liveaboard puts the boat at risk. ????? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 The Baileys email said "Unfortunately they do see live aboards as a higher risk and therefore charge more and have a higher excess in this situation" Usual unsurprising insurance industry smokescreen bullshit. Very good at taking "their" money off you.... Anyway, I've emailed Baileys to clarify what our situation is. My understanding is that we are allowed to move for "safety" reasons, which makes sense as long as we know what "safety" they are referring to? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fogg 427 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 2 concepts: 1. Passive risk when not in use eg on moooring or marina. Fire, weather, hit by another boat out of control etc. 2. Dynamic risk when in use eg collision, grounding, dragged anchor, dropped rig, gas or electrical issues etc etc. #1 is low but not zero. #2 is higher. Liveaboards do more of #2 than #1 hence higher risk and premium. Regardless of your personal experience and track record statistically risk increases with use. When you buy insurance you (perhaps unwittingly) buy into this statistical model. If you don’t like it don’t buy it! Similar concept to cars ie risk increases from low to higher as you drive away from home. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Aleana said: 2 concepts: 1. Passive risk when not in use eg on moooring or marina. Fire, weather, hit by another boat out of control etc. 2. Dynamic risk when in use eg collision, grounding, dragged anchor, dropped rig, gas or electrical issues etc etc. #1 is low but not zero. #2 is higher. Liveaboards do more of #2 than #1 hence higher risk and premium. Regardless of your personal experience and track record statistically risk increases with use. When you buy insurance you (perhaps unwittingly) buy into this statistical model. If you don’t like it don’t buy it! Similar concept to cars ie risk increases from low to higher as you drive away from home. Hmmm, I was actually more interested in trying to work out what the hell I'm insured for, but thanks for the response. I'd be keen to see any figures you have but I'm assuming you are just conceptualising? Try these completely opposite concepts: 1. Boat kept on marina and rarely used or maintained. Owner inexperienced, more $$ than sense, boat used solely for week holiday in summer. A disaster waiting to happen. 2. Owner-occupier living aboard. Experienced in all things marine from a lifetime spent on boats. Boat maintained to a high standard at all times. I would not assume liveaboards are more #2 than #1 because it would be a complete f'in guess. But hell, I'm not in insurance!! 8>) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fogg 427 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 Yes you’re right in your example risk #1 is probably worse than #2 because of the specific extra details you’ve outlined. But in the insurance scenario how do they assess that at time of underwriting? Can you imagine them asking you “Are you an accident waiting to happen with more money then sense?” or “Are you a sensible, safe and experienced mariner?”. They obviously can’t so instead use general questions and statistical models based on a large pooled risk concept plus some additional personalisation of risk as far as they can eg age, location, usage etc. But these questions are just proxies for risk indicators but often very crude. Car insurers have started to improve on this by offering more accurate risk-based premiums by getting you to download their App which assesses your actual driving behaviour (acceleration, braking, location, time of day, weather, traffic, texting & driving etc) and they are using this as far more accurate indicator of true risk than a bunch of general questions at time of sale - resulting in real-time premiums that literally vary by hour of the day and how you’re driving. But boat insurance is a long way off that... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,211 Posted April 22, 2020 Author Share Posted April 22, 2020 My insurance co do ask about experience and qualifications. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fogg 427 Posted April 22, 2020 Share Posted April 22, 2020 But that’s been shown to be an inaccurate indicator. Many newbies to boating (rightly) go and get some basic competency quals and these might help but we also know many boaties with zero qualifications but have accumulated a lifetime of boating experience that is far more valuable than a newbie with a fist full of certificates. So in short, it’s not easy hence the fallback model of general stats tends to dominate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,211 Posted April 23, 2020 Author Share Posted April 23, 2020 True, but they asked for a resume basically, including qualifications Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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