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Okahu Hard Stand meeting


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17 minutes ago, Black Panther said:

Strange article,  doesn't say why this is a problem. 

Some of it is self evident.  Oldies tend to consume less personally and so spend less in the local economy.  As communities age, the infrastructure needs change - for example schools shrink driving a reduction in teachers and other staff who leave and make the population older on average.  Families consider the state of the local school and it's loss of capacity and exit for locations with better or broader education opportunities.  This again reinforces the aging.

Eventually the community is ALL old people.  It becomes more unattractive for young people.  Property values decline because there are too many of them.  Councils have problems as their rating base disappears and those left are not able to meet the cost of maintaining community assets.

And on it goes.

We spoke about the problem at length with people in Japan.  Villages around ski fields are having exactly this problem.  The towns are dying despite having relatively strong tourism and winter sport industries.  The young people are happy to visit, but they live in larger urban locations with better opportunities.  Consequently you can buy a house in a popular Japanese ski town for less than 100k NZD

I use the word better in its broadly understood, 20th century capitalist sense.

I'd add that hyper-aging is only slightly worse than hyper-youthing which has its own problems.  Communities need balance.

Including access to reasonably priced hardstands.

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1 hour ago, Black Panther said:

Strange article,  doesn't say why this is a problem. 

Think about it in the housing world, no first home buyers and dwindling renters means no one to support the bottom rung as you climb the ladder. Same with yachting, no one to buy the boats, let alone crew them if oldies predominate.

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2 hours ago, aardvarkash10 said:

Some of it is self evident.  Oldies tend to consume less personally and so spend less in the local economy.  As communities age, the infrastructure needs change - for example schools shrink driving a reduction in teachers and other staff who leave and make the population older on average.  Families consider the state of the local school and it's loss of capacity and exit for locations with better or broader education opportunities.  This again reinforces the aging.

Eventually the community is ALL old people.  It becomes more unattractive for young people.  Property values decline because there are too many of them.  Councils have problems as their rating base disappears and those left are not able to meet the cost of maintaining community assets.

 

Some would argue that lower house prices would be a good thing. And once they do people might consider getting pregnant again. Councils don't need as big a rating base as they don't  have to provide as much

2 hours ago, aardvarkash10 said:

And on it goes.

We spoke about the problem at length with people in Japan.  Villages around ski fields are having exactly this problem.  The towns are dying despite having relatively strong tourism and winter sport industries.  The young people are happy to visit, but they live in larger urban locations with better opportunities.  Consequently you can buy a house in a popular Japanese ski town for less than 100k NZD

I use the word better in its broadly understood, 20th century capitalist sense.

I'd add that hyper-aging is only slightly worse than hyper-youthing which has its own problems.  Communities need balance.

Including access to reasonably priced hardstands.

 

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1 hour ago, Psyche said:

Think about it in the housing world, no first home buyers and dwindling renters means no one to support the bottom rung as you climb the ladder. Same with yachting, no one to buy the boats, let alone crew them if oldies predominate.

There will still be some and they'll be able to afford to buy coz lower prices.

Personally I think a shrinking population sounds great.

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11 minutes ago, Black Panther said:

 

Some would argue that lower house prices would be a good thing. And once they do people might consider getting pregnant again. Councils don't need as big a rating base as they don't  have to provide as much

 

Some might and I might be one of them.  but the reality I've seen elsewhere and in NZ is that all things being equal a location with excessive proportions of elderly people almost invariably decays and dies.  It would take a significant and concerted intervention to turn this around.

/another threadjacking

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A shrinking aging population is bad news all round, who is going to pay for the pensions and healthcare let alone buy the boats lol! The abandoned boats we see around town are not just the result of young working age people getting bored with their toys, I suspect its a lot of older owners who no longer have the energy to look after them and the families dont care about boats. 

Look at Italy as an example, it is projected that by 2050 that for every 100 workers there will be 63 pensioners, and thats an optimistic assumption it could even be more!  NZ hopefully wont be as awful but we are an aging population.

These changes appear glacial but who would have thought in the 70's that diy boatbuilding would literally die in NZ and that keelboating would be under so much negative pressure?

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But there are way more aspects to human occupation than just who pays for pensions. In an assessment it would make sense to include all factors. 

Our current bubble of old farts will oass, just like your snake   i read that by the next election  only 25% of voters wilk be boomers, 25,% millenials and 50% alphabet soup.

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True, but our system would need to change quite radically if we wanted to retain the same standard of living. As I said who is going to buy the boats if there are less boating age people with an interest? Its rhetorical because who really cares about what happens when you kick it, but in the here and now places like Okahu Bay are under pressure because of a shrinking yachting community. Age is one factor, cost is another, competing sports/pastimes yet another, time- who has that these days unless you're a beneficiary (pensioner lol) lifestyler or well heeled. 

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Great Turnout of support with over 100 people there to support the Hard Stand.

The AYBA/Auckland Recrational Marine Users Group (I think that was their name) gave a really good 10min presentation pointing out that their Consultation was legally flawed as they treated it as just a local reserve, when it is actually a regionally significant piece of coastal infrastructure. It was a polite way to hint, "you are going to get legally challenged" if you don't reconsider and do a proper legal round of consultation. The board then briefly debated how to accept this presentation and next steps, voting to accept it and ask their staff to review the points raised. 

I then gave a 3min presentation on behalf the NZ Multihull YC showing how that yard is unique in the region and the multihull specific gear that no other commercial yard in the region has. 

Liz Alonzi (NZMYC) gave a really good 3min presentation, showing the human side of closing the yard and that she would need to take Timberwolf to Whangarei to haul it. 

Unbelievable, the RAYC Commodore then gave a presentation about why they want the yard closed, including requesting they would like the lease the land for storage. This is from the self proclaimed "Premier Blue Water yacht club of New Zealand." The RAYC presentation was followed by similar one from the Akarana Marine Sports Trust supporting closing the yard. 

So no decisions made but hopefully the AYBA have scared the board enough to trigger a proper round of consultation and the yard can be saved through that. 

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14 minutes ago, Adrianp said:

Unbelievable, the RAYC Commodore then gave a presentation about why they want the yard closed, including requesting they would like the lease the land for storage. This is from the self proclaimed "Premier Blue Water yacht club of New Zealand." The RAYC presentation was followed by similar one from the Akarana Marine Sports Trust supporting closing the yard. 

Such a short sighted, ridiculous point of view.  I cannot believe that is supported by many of the sailors who are (well, if were me, WERE) members. 

I'm honestly stunned that RAYC does not want to support big boat sailing anymore.  To be fair, the last event I saw was wind warriors, they don't need much hard stand space for maintenance I suppose.

 

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1 hour ago, Adrianp said:

Unbelievable, the RAYC Commodore then gave a presentation about why they want the yard closed, including requesting they would like the lease the land for storage. This is from the self proclaimed "Premier Blue Water yacht club of New Zealand." The RAYC presentation was followed by similar one from the Akarana Marine Sports Trust supporting closing the yard. 

🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️😠😠😠

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Pretty disappointed in the RAYC, one would think that the local club would be in favour of a yard. Seems it's a bit of a land grab at the expense of the rest of the boating community, but its get curiouser and curiouser:

image.png.032a34c0ac1a30e94a81456e6c7c7784.png

https://infocouncil.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/Open/2022/05/OR_20220519_MIN_10698.PDF

 

I am a bit biased, I started sailing with the R's out of Okahu bay when the Auckland Sailing Club was the home of M's, lots of great memories of the area as a hardstand with a deep connection to sailing. 

 

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