Harbourmaster warns boaties maust have wreck-removal insurance

[K4309 395]

Sabre 20. In Paremata and in need of a serious clean.

Free to a good home!

[K4309 395]

Salthouse 25 heavily fouled, has rig and sails, moored Shelly Park, south Auckland. Free for removal

[K4309 395]

And this sort of thing is common. Photo of several derelict boats at Little Shoal Bay, one that someone is trying to move on...

Hi all, may be of interest for someone looking for a cheap Trailer sailor . The boat in pic my friend Hector owned some years sgo he sold it to a chap by name of Ken . but i know Ken is most unwell and this little 20ft Trailer sailor (forget the design name ) would be going cheap (very ) its at LSB N Shore . Ken had two other boats at LSB a big tri that the houbour board towed away and cut up , plus Ken had another Trailer sailor 20ft he sold for 500 dollars just to get rid of it . I have sailed to W Island on the one in Picture with My Mate Hector when he owned it , good little Yacht . if anyone is interested I can find out Kens details as I will be that way on Weekend , cheers Bob . PS boat in fore ground .

[K4309 395]

And this situation:

Kauri 26 ft motor sailer. Bulid north shore approx 1960

Needs to go as mooring adjacent to Herald island no longer available Any offers gratefully accepted Photos taken several years ago. Has been on mooring since then with little maintainence

[aardvarkash10 1,084]

1 hour ago, K4309 said:

Currently, the only option is to give it away to someone else

Nope,that's not the only option.

It's the cheapest, but not the only.

If you own a boat that is truly end of life, you should dispose of it appropriately.  Pull it out, break it up, sell reusable stuff eg winches, send the rest to managed landfill.

Trouble is, that costs.

Psyche's proposal is a solution if the cost falls fairly.  Owners have to take some reasonable responsibility.

There is an existing model - cars.  End of life cars are now (mostly) disposed of by the owner at a cost.

 

[K4309 395]

30 minutes ago, aardvarkash10 said:

Nope,that's not the only option.

It's the cheapest, but not the only.

If you own a boat that is truly end of life, you should dispose of it appropriately.  Pull it out, break it up, sell reusable stuff eg winches, send the rest to managed landfill.

Trouble is, that costs.

Psyche's proposal is a solution if the cost falls fairly.  Owners have to take some reasonable responsibility.

There is an existing model - cars.  End of life cars are now (mostly) disposed of by the owner at a cost.

 

That sounds great in theory, but in practice, it turns into a flying spaghetti monster.

And it is not about cost, although that is a factor.

The issue is compliance.

Can you tell me where you can haul a boat out and break it down? Will Pier 21 do it? Gulf Harbour? Last I heard it was a struggle to get those places to haul a boat just to do the antifoul.

If you don't have insurance, is there anywhere that will haul you out? let alone then allow you to smash the boat to bits there?

Have you ever tried finding a dump truck operator to take a smashed boat to a landfill? It is very, very complicated. They are liable for compliance issues at the landfill around toxins - what we normally refer to as anti-foul, and of course oils, and a wide array of other nasties found in boats.

Sure, it can be done in theory. But finding land you can do it on is one issue. Finding contractors that will do it is another. Getting the job done without breaching some rule or regulation is another. I've been involved with this process and the only way it happened, in a Council car park infront of sports clubs and a beach reserve, is cause the boat was already wrecked on the beach and that is where we dragged it too so that it wasn't smashed up on the beach, in the sand etc.

Your example of an existing model is not applicable. People get paid for their old cars. There is substantial existing infrastructure around disposing of cars. It is a whole industry. Currently, you can't google a boat disposal company and just pay someone to sort out your former pride and joy. You do that for cars and you will have guys around the next morning offering you cash.

In my view the Harbour Masters need to stop whining and set up a solution, somewhere that boats can voluntarily be dismantled and disposed of responsibly.

[K4309 395]

Oh, and if your boat is insured, the only way you are going to get the insurance co to sort it out is by wrecking it.

You can't phone PIC and say I don't want my boat anymore, can you guys dispose of it for me?

[Guest 129]

13 minutes ago, K4309 said:

That sounds great in theory, but in practice, it turns into a flying spaghetti monster.

And it is not about cost, although that is a factor.

The issue is compliance.

Can you tell me where you can haul a boat out and break it down? Will Pier 21 do it? Gulf Harbour? Last I heard it was a struggle to get those places to haul a boat just to do the antifoul.

If you don't have insurance, is there anywhere that will haul you out? let alone then allow you to smash the boat to bits there?

Have you ever tried finding a dump truck operator to take a smashed boat to a landfill? It is very, very complicated. They are liable for compliance issues at the landfill around toxins - what we normally refer to as anti-foul, and of course oils, and a wide array of other nasties found in boats.

Sure, it can be done in theory. But finding land you can do it on is one issue. Finding contractors that will do it is another. Getting the job done without breaching some rule or regulation is another. I've been involved with this process and the only way it happened, in a Council car park infront of sports clubs and a beach reserve, is cause the boat was already wrecked on the beach and that is where we dragged it too so that it wasn't smashed up on the beach, in the sand etc.

Your example of an existing model is not applicable. People get paid for their old cars. There is substantial existing infrastructure around disposing of cars. It is a whole industry. Currently, you can't google a boat disposal company and just pay someone to sort out your former pride and joy. You do that for cars and you will have guys around the next morning offering you cash.

In my view the Harbour Masters need to stop whining and set up a solution, somewhere that boats can voluntarily be dismantled and disposed of responsibly.

The only post comprehensively in touch with reality.

[Psyche 775]

40 minutes ago, aardvarkash10 said:

End of life cars are now (mostly) disposed of by the owner at a cost.

amazingly you get about $500 for a car or used a few years ago.

[Guest 129]

AA, google cash for your car.

[aardvarkash10 1,084]

point is, there is an acceptance of responsibility, not a passing on of it to some as-yet-undefined and no doubt publicly funded entity.

Its actually well easy to arrange for removal and disposal.  Boats are hauled and road transported all the time, and there are disposal and transfer stations around the country.  Add it up guys.

Again, it just costs.

[Psyche 775]

Thats the problem, if people have no money in the first place to maintain it they're unlikely to pay for disposal. I am  not sure it is that easy for some boats to be disposed of, they have to be towed to a ramp or hard stand (where?) health and safely protocols, tip fees, glass boats have to be sawn up, wooden and concrete can be crushed, steel is gas axe material but regardless engines and refrigeration systems need to be removed. The details matter, what will the tip accept and how far from the ramp is it....

If the HM set up a dedicated haul out and got the systems in place they could roll through 2,3 or more boats a day depending. The problem is getting rid of eyesores and navigation hazards, if people cant pay they wont pay so the govt must step in.

[K4309 395]

23 minutes ago, aardvarkash10 said:

point is, there is an acceptance of responsibility, not a passing on of it to some as-yet-undefined and no doubt publicly funded entity.

Its actually well easy to arrange for removal and disposal.  Boats are hauled and road transported all the time, and there are disposal and transfer stations around the country.  Add it up guys.

Again, it just costs.

Please, try it.

Then come back and tell us how you got on.

The boat owners I have helped have been accepting of their responsibility. It is just very hard to get the job done in any legal or legitimate way.

[K4309 395]

1 hour ago, aardvarkash10 said:

point is, there is an acceptance of responsibility, not a passing on of it to some as-yet-undefined and no doubt publicly funded entity.

Its actually well easy to arrange for removal and disposal.  Boats are hauled and road transported all the time, and there are disposal and transfer stations around the country.  Add it up guys.

Again, it just costs.

Below is the list of exclusions at Waste Management's Transfer Stations. If you put your boat on a Boat Transport Truck, and rocked up to a transfer station, they aren't going to let you in the gate, let alone leave your boat there.

I'm sorry if I sound rude, but anyone thinking it is easy to dispose of an old boat is just ignorant. Please try it. You will then understand what I'm banging on about.

The usual exclusions are oil and any known toxins, as in antifoul. Anything flammable, such as the content of the impossible to drain properly fuel tank. Flammable solids is an interesting one. Swabs, liners and every fibreglass boat. Noting of course you pay by the kg, so you'll need to find some land somewhere to remove the keel and engine before transporting the hull to a transfer station.

In practice you have to strip the hull back on the exterior, and empty and clean the interior, just to be able to dump it. Most people that have the ability to do that, either financial or physically, are probably going to be able to maintain their boat in the first place.

Exclusions:

• Asbestos
• Dangerous goods such as; flammable liquids, flammable solids, poisons, pool chemicals, gas bottles, paint
• Explosives and fireworks
• Agricultural residues or chemicals
• Scrap motor cars
• Animal by-products e.g. carcases, offal
• Medical waste of any nature
• Firearms
• Tractor / OTR tyres

North Shore Transfer Station

[Psyche 775]

42 minutes ago, K4309 said:

Below is the list of exclusions at Waste Management's Transfer Stations. If you put your boat on a Boat Transport Truck, and rocked up to a transfer station, they aren't going to let you in the gate, let alone leave your boat there.

I'm sorry if I sound rude, but anyone thinking it is easy to dispose of an old boat is just ignorant. Please try it. You will then understand what I'm banging on about.

The usual exclusions are oil and any known toxins, as in antifoul. Anything flammable, such as the content of the impossible to drain properly fuel tank. Flammable solids is an interesting one. Swabs, liners and every fibreglass boat. Noting of course you pay by the kg, so you'll need to find some land somewhere to remove the keel and engine before transporting the hull to a transfer station.

In practice you have to strip the hull back on the exterior, and empty and clean the interior, just to be able to dump it. Most people that have the ability to do that, either financial or physically, are probably going to be able to maintain their boat in the first place.

Exclusions:

• Asbestos
• Dangerous goods such as; flammable liquids, flammable solids, poisons, pool chemicals, gas bottles, paint
• Explosives and fireworks
• Agricultural residues or chemicals
• Scrap motor cars
• Animal by-products e.g. carcases, offal
• Medical waste of any nature
• Firearms
• Tractor / OTR tyres

North Shore Transfer Station

Boat disposal en masse is never going to happen without outside assistance, I repeat my assertion; people who cant pay wont pay

 

[harrytom 688]

Elderly friend recently paid the AK harbour master $500 to have vessel removed and cut in to scrap,steel roberts 45ft roughly.$500 token gesture to true cost to cut up. Then you Jason trying to selling this for gold,was $500 now $1500

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/listing/5049770568

[Murky 0]

Lots were broken up and disposed of legitimately post-Gabrielle here in Northland, by professional teams (staff of boatyard and general contractors, under the oversight of Harbourmaster and perhaps most importantly, funded by an insurer in a lot of cases). Already in possession of/trained in use of the right equipment and probably already quite good at meeting relevant legislation and submitting any documentation required. So it can be done but yes harder on a DIY basis without some of the factors above.

Agree with Psyche re can't pay/won't pay and also think there is a substantial emotional component where the current owner doesn't (yet) that their 'asset' tipped over the edge into becoming a liability quite some time ago. They were all originally built with love, often to a well-regarded design from good materials that cost a lot at the time.

[waikiore 461]

I was at the North Shore station when most of a Townson 28 turned up, to be fair they had removed lead and toxic materials but they were still refused and told in no uncertain terms to sail on out again. Also saw a Harmonic (probably the plug) being burnt on a boatbuilders farm because no one would take it for free . 

[Black Panther 1,745]

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