Lithium conversion

[Doug 0]

Can anyone recommend a good marine electrician to install lithium batteries. I’m in Auckland/ Gulf Harbour. Thanks.

[Island Time 1,313]

What would you like to know? I work out of GH, and have a few customers here with Lithium conversions. 2 more upcoming... feel free to call me if you wish.

Matt

Neptune's Gear Ltd

0221539176

 

[Doug 0]

Well I’m just starting to look into the lithium option on a fairly new production boat. My first query is whether it’s possible to give a ball park $$  cost of changing out the house batteries for two 200ah lithiums that are EWOF capable. I’m assuming all the components will need changing including existing charger, solar regulators , fuses etc and alternator protection. I read somewhere only 3 brands will meetEWOF requirements…Juice, Victron and ?? .  What kind of budget is realistic assuming current installation of  AGMs is clean and tidy . 

[Island Time 1,313]

The answer is "it depends".

Best way would be to take a look, as makes and models of all devices are needed to answer that question.

No decent marine electrician will install a system that does not comply with the current NZ regs -AS/NZS 3004 (and therefore meets Ewof stds). The main issue here is both Audio and Visual alarms before a batt disconnect. 

Entry level (one install I'm doing on 14th for example) will be approx $4k installed (using existing DC-DC), 314 A/hr fully compliant. Another I did recently was $14k, 942 A/hr,  Dual alternator conversion etc....

[Island Time 1,313]

Oh, and what Brand or production boat? I can show you installs on Hanse, Jenneau, Bene and a few others...

[Doug 0]

1 hour ago, Island Time said:

Oh, and what Brand or production boat? I can show you installs on Hanse, Jenneau, Bene and a few others...

Ok that’s helpful, 2015 Beneteau. Currently running a 125Ah alternator.

[Doug 0]

This seems a good over view

 

[Vivaldi 57]

I can recommend IT - he’s done great work for us and provided good advice when needed. 

[Psyche 850]

Try getting the standards to see what's required if you want to DIY or just to get your existing LA system updated as per the regs, they are all paywalled which I think is self defeating if you want people to comply with them. 

[aardvarkash10 1,138]

2 hours ago, Psyche said:

Try getting the standards to see what's required if you want to DIY or just to get your existing LA system updated as per the regs, they are all paywalled which I think is self defeating if you want people to comply with them. 

Alternative view. 

If you are serious about doing the project, paying for the IP that sets out the required standard is not unreasonable.  Its probably the lowest cost component in the entire project.

I'm a fan of letting the professionals deal with all that.  The many technical standards I've been involved with assume a high level of technical competence - higher by far than Joe Blow wanting to DIY a job has.

[Psyche 850]

Intellectual property? Ok but tightly held by a government organisation that sets standards? Essentially, we're paying for the Information twice. 
 

I'm pretty sure the standards related to lithium battery installation are not rocket science, we essentially know what needs to be done but the specifics of it are not publicly available unless you pay. 

A good an analogy would be an act of parliament, publicly available and with a bit of effort you can understand the gist but to interpret the nuance, you need a specialist

 

[Doug 0]

Yes definately need EWOF compliance and  risk free installation as far as that is possible. Insurer requires installation or sign off by marine electrician .  Burnsco have confirmed none of the lithium battery brands they sell are compliant. 

[aardvarkash10 1,138]

1 hour ago, Psyche said:

Intellectual property? Ok but tightly held by a government organisation that sets standards? Essentially, we're paying for the Information twice. 
 

I'm pretty sure the standards related to lithium battery installation are not rocket science, we essentially know what needs to be done but the specifics of it are not publicly available unless you pay. 

A good an analogy would be an act of parliament, publicly available and with a bit of effort you can understand the gist but to interpret the nuance, you need a specialist

 

Plumbing standards, domestic and commercial electrical standards, gas fitting standards, motor vehicle design and construction standards, standards for the construction of houses.

None of these are free to access.  

Again, most people lack the technical knowledge to interpret a technical standard.  The ASNZ standard for lithium installations is about $250 in pdf format so it's unlikely that access to the standard is actually holding back people dying to DIY it.

[CarpeDiem 537]

Available at public libraries - check out the catalog.

There's actually sfa to the Lithium install rules and its content has already been posted in this forum pretty much verbatim.

 

[Guest 142]

Whether you know the rules or not , insurance companies will give you the cold shoulder if you diy without a commercial installer’s certification of proficiency . (Ime, anyway) And they have little comprehension of AYBC E13. Not that there is much to follow.

As CD said, he and IT have covered the niceties. Not that it will help the diyers with insurance even if you blind them with contingency electrical engineering.

Btw, I used to pay $300 every so often for updates to NZS3604, seems they are mostly free now. Guess there’s not much point in having “industry best practice” behind a paywall.🙄

[Psyche 850]

4 hours ago, aardvarkash10 said:

Plumbing standards, domestic and commercial electrical standards, gas fitting standards, motor vehicle design and construction standards, standards for the construction of houses.

None of these are free to access.  

Again, most people lack the technical knowledge to interpret a technical standard.  The ASNZ standard for lithium installations is about $250 in pdf format so it's unlikely that access to the standard is actually holding back people dying to DIY it.

For another discussion so we don't get side tracked, I still dont agree that public standards should be behind a paywall. Once upon a time you could go the govt bookshop behind the St James and get or order pretty much whatever publication by any ministry for a nominal fee.

Thanks for the library tip CD, you're right we have a pretty good idea of what and how. 

[bigal.nz 62]

On 5/07/2025 at 6:03 PM, aardvarkash10 said:

Plumbing standards, domestic and commercial electrical standards, gas fitting standards, motor vehicle design and construction standards, standards for the construction of houses.

None of these are free to access.  

Again, most people lack the technical knowledge to interpret a technical standard.  The ASNZ standard for lithium installations is about $250 in pdf format so it's unlikely that access to the standard is actually holding back people dying to DIY it.

The good thing bout installing yourself is when you are 500 miles from shore and it breaks you at least have a fighting chance of fixing it or making a safe work around. DIY is fine as long as its well researched, and as I often do with some professional input and/or oversight.

Does the inspector fail it because it was DIY or fail it because it doesn't meet the standard?
If I was paying someone to do it - then i would use Matt (but he is so far away!)

[Guest 142]

Thing is professional installers are reluctant  to  certify a diy as they didn’t do it and more to the point, didn’t get compensated for it. Why should their warranty cover something that is their core business yet they missed out on bulk margin? I guess there are installers that may but they will check every circuit and cascading fail safes  consequently charging heaps to the extent they may as well have done it.

I wouldn’t warranty someone else’s work. It’s grief you just don’t need. No reflection on the diyer.

 Based on that, I am somewhat disingenuous expecting the insurance co to do to contrary. But, I’m going to take this up with insurance co as I didn’t get any premium discount for not covering LiFe system or  resulting damage from.

That said BA, I’m in your camp. (“Need to know how to fix”) Also 3yrs ac/dc in a NZCE mech engineering helps.(ahem, 1975) but good ole ohms law still applies.

Absolutely do a circuit diag  on board & label everything. Unless you have a photographic memory.(not me)

Agree with “it’s not rocket science.”

[Frank 185]

Most of the LiFEPo set up in the land yacht was done by HMB Electrical, (Hope I'm not breaking protocol in mentioning them but they were good)  I did the battery box and one or two minor items myself after consultation with their contracted  inspector who issued the  EWOF. So yes there was an element of DIY but that was done  per the inspectors guidance mostly to ensure there were no surprises for either party. Since I was initially intimidated by the seemingly complex circuitry  I was hoping to be a bit dumb about it, pay some money and get a "turn-key package" . I should have known better Tuning/tweaking the system and fixing one fault  meant that in the end had to wrap my head around it, this is not hard but there is a bit to cover so it takes a while to digest it all. The various suggested Circuit diagrams online are helpful but you wouldn't want to copy one without understanding what's going on.  Eventually Once It all fell it all place I did a circuit diagram, I must admit having a mechatronics engineer for a son and a Bro who is super geek did help.