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Suspected pirates given fuel and food


rigger

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Seems nuts to me, they have the weapons, they were caught in the act, perhaps a law change is required, summary execution if caught in the act of piracy

 

THE Netherlands has released 13 suspected Somali pirates held on a Dutch warship, on the grounds that no country was willing to prosecute them, writes David Osler . The men were put back on their speedboat with supplies of food and fuel, it was announced. A Dutch defence ministry statement said the European Union had decided that it had to free the detainees because it was impossible to bring charges.Although the EU had signed agreements with the Seychelles and Kenya to prosecute suspected pirates, “the two countries indicated they did not want to prosecute the pirates”, the ministry added.The suspects were seized in the Indian Ocean two weeks ago after allegedly attempting to attack the 2007-built, 7,800 dwt BBC Togo and detained on board warship Evertsen ... According to the Lloyd’s MIU database, the vessel is associated with Bremen-based Candler Schiffahrt. EU Navfor said that ladders, grappling hooks, nine automatic weapons, grenades and other ammunition had been found on board their skiffs. “The European Union has tried in vain since their arrest to find a country which would agree to prosecute them,” the defence ministry statement said. “The defence ministry regrets that the European Union has not found a suitable solution.”
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Give these guys a break. They did NOT do anything illegal, so theoretically should not be convicted.

These guys used to be fishermen, but because their country is in such disarray the rest of the 'World' helped themselves to their fish, now these fishermen have no alternative to feed their family.

These guys have guts, and have carved out a niche that they are making viable. They give me the same feel of the Pirates of old, with one difference, they are VERY wary of killing their captors, because they no there is no return for 'dead meat'

Boats do not NEED to go through these waters, apart from the fact that the $$$$ are there going through the Suez.

Any Cruisers know the dangers (what happened to that british couple) and are fools to go there.

If they get caught, I'm generally sorry, if they get away with it, I exalt, as they have overcome the odds of world greed, and are once again stamping their ownership on their waters.

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Give these guys a break. They did NOT do anything illegal, so theoretically should not be convicted.

These guys used to be fishermen, but because their country is in such disarray the rest of the 'World' helped themselves to their fish, now these fishermen have no alternative to feed their family.

These guys have guts, and have carved out a niche that they are making viable. They give me the same feel of the Pirates of old, with one difference, they are VERY wary of killing their captors, because they no there is no return for 'dead meat'

Boats do not NEED to go through these waters, apart from the fact that the $$$$ are there going through the Suez.

Any Cruisers know the dangers (what happened to that british couple) and are fools to go there.

If they get caught, I'm generally sorry, if they get away with it, I exalt, as they have overcome the odds of world greed, and are once again stamping their ownership on their waters.

 

 

Bloody brilliant and well said.

 

Imagine someone from another country drag netting Hauraki Gulfs snapper stocks and rooting your fishing income / resource!

 

I bet most of you would be throwing guns at the local fisherman to go out and gain a income from the "rich Passer by's"... and at least get a income from thier "now useless" boat.

 

I back the Somali's and love thier skill and attitude!! After all who else will fight for them?

Kiwis would do nothing!'

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All very good and high and mighty till YOU are the one being held by the pirates, how long till you're squealing for some "civilised" country to come and rescue you or front up with some bribe money??-- Hang em all !!

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why would you not want to sail near the Seychelles?, absolutely amazing. Imagine if the whole of the Pacific went the same way, would we just "avoid" that too since we've been taking a few too many resources from there too?? Same arguments from Johnmi could easily apply there, watch out when Fiji starts "apprehending" people and asking for cash in return, would end up to scared to go anywhere..I stand by my comments, Hang em all.

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I like the Black eyed Peas song with the Lyrick, "Wars are going on, but the reasons under cover".

Somalia is a sad sad mixed up place with lots of fighting and it is so confusing, the Reason is certainly undercover. In fact it mostly just snuck away and left completely.

Back in 1991, the then President or PrimeMinister or leader of Somalia and the Gvt fell. But nothing replaced it. So there is no leadership and no one to represent the country before the United Nations and any other relevant organisation.

Somalia has the longest coast line on the African Continent. Some 3300Kms. None of it under any one controlling authority. With much of the country having gone to many factions, each Faction control their own small part of the Coastline. Some of those Faction leaders have entered into some rather disturbing fishing agreements with a couple of foreign countries. The result is that the sea is being heavily fished and local fisherman are not catching what they used to. So other "Clans" are trying to protect themselves from starvation and as they see it, illegal fishing of their waters. And the fishing going on by these other nations is being likened to strip mining. They are simply stripping the environment of everything. Fishing vessels known to operate off Somalia include the following flags: Belize (either French or Spanish-owned purse seiners operating under flag of convenience to avoid EU regulations); France (purse seiners targeting tuna licensed to the food company Cobrecaf); Honduras (EU purse seiners targeting tuna under flag of convenience); Japan (longliners now operate under licence to the Republic of Somaliland); Kenya (Mombasa-based trawlers); Korea (longliners targeting swordfish seasonally); Pakistan (trawlers, but also targeting shark); Saudi Arabia (trawlers); Spain (purse seiners targeting tuna); Sri Lanka (trawlers, plus longliners targeting shark under licence to the Republic of Somaliland and based at Berbera, Somaliland); Taiwan (longliners targeting swordfish seasonally); and Yemen (trawlers financed by a seafood importer in Bari, Italy). Formerly operated as the Somali national fleet, four Yemeni trawlers and a collector vessel are now based in Aden

Now get this, The international community encourages local Somali administrative entities to take responsibility for governance of the region, So the International Community is saying to "Clans" that are at war with each other and know no other means of negotiation than that of a Gun Barrel to go protect their waters. And then when they do, they get called Pirates.

It's all one big mess and it is safe to say the Somalian Warlords are not totally to blame with this outcome. Not saying they are innocent either. But certianlly not the only ones to blame. Other nations are simply reaping the profits of War at the cost of a poor and very very hungry people, and then pointing the finger at them as to being the sole quilty party.

So people making comments like "hang them all" is a little arrogant when not all the reasons are fully understood.

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All very good and high and mighty till YOU are the one being held by the pirates, how long till you're squealing for some "civilised" country to come and rescue you or front up with some bribe money??-- Hang em all !!

 

Oh dear :crazy:

 

Firstly I would'nt sail in those waters in the first place!

 

Obviously you would!

 

And the "Hang em all" comment just shows your "high and mightyness".

 

You would hang some poor person because they fight for thier survival!... how sad are you!

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I like the Black eyed Peas song with the Lyrick, "Wars are going on, but the reasons under cover".

Somalia is a sad sad mixed up place with lots of fighting and it is so confusing, the Reason is certainly undercover. In fact it mostly just snuck away and left completely.

Back in 1991, the then President or PrimeMinister or leader of Somalia and the Gvt fell. But nothing replaced it. So there is no leadership and no one to represent the country before the United Nations and any other relevant organisation.

Somalia has the longest coast line on the African Continent. Some 3300Kms. None of it under any one controlling authority. With much of the country having gone to many factions, each Faction control their own small part of the Coastline. Some of those Faction leaders have entered into some rather disturbing fishing agreements with a couple of foreign countries. The result is that the sea is being heavily fished and local fisherman are not catching what they used to. So other "Clans" are trying to protect themselves from starvation and as they see it, illegal fishing of their waters. And the fishing going on by these other nations is being likened to strip mining. They are simply stripping the environment of everything. Fishing vessels known to operate off Somalia include the following flags: Belize (either French or Spanish-owned purse seiners operating under flag of convenience to avoid EU regulations); France (purse seiners targeting tuna licensed to the food company Cobrecaf); Honduras (EU purse seiners targeting tuna under flag of convenience); Japan (longliners now operate under licence to the Republic of Somaliland); Kenya (Mombasa-based trawlers); Korea (longliners targeting swordfish seasonally); Pakistan (trawlers, but also targeting shark); Saudi Arabia (trawlers); Spain (purse seiners targeting tuna); Sri Lanka (trawlers, plus longliners targeting shark under licence to the Republic of Somaliland and based at Berbera, Somaliland); Taiwan (longliners targeting swordfish seasonally); and Yemen (trawlers financed by a seafood importer in Bari, Italy). Formerly operated as the Somali national fleet, four Yemeni trawlers and a collector vessel are now based in Aden

Now get this, The international community encourages local Somali administrative entities to take responsibility for governance of the region, So the International Community is saying to "Clans" that are at war with each other and know no other means of negotiation than that of a Gun Barrel to go protect their waters. And then when they do, they get called Pirates.

It's all one big mess and it is safe to say the Somalian Warlords are not totally to blame with this outcome. Not saying they are innocent either. But certianlly not the only ones to blame. Other nations are simply reaping the profits of War at the cost of a poor and very very hungry people, and then pointing the finger at them as to being the sole quilty party.

So people making comments like "hang them all" is a little arrogant when not all the reasons are fully understood.

 

NiceWheels nice!

 

Lets face it they (Somali's)are not the fools here!...

 

they turn up to a gun fight with a bloody fishing dingy and a gun and fight the might of the "commercial world" and win!

 

These commercial and private dipsticks are so stupid to even think of entering these waters with so much to lose!

 

diametricaly opposed to this are the somali's who have everything to gain!

 

and all they are fighting for is "to be heard" and to get back a "lost" income.

 

and some people call them Pirates :wtf: ???... Robin Hoods maybe!

 

I think some people on this thread see Somali's as they see Mr Mugabe! :crazy:

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well, maybe I don't understand all the issues so my final comment on this is: Next time, some bad guys take any of your stuff, hope you buy them lunch and also set up a monthly AP to them as they probably also had a rough deal in the past.

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Give these guys a break. They did NOT do anything illegal

Not sure how far off the coast they were when taken but read the quote from the story - they were caught in the act

The suspects were seized in the Indian Ocean two weeks ago after allegedly attempting to attack the 2007-built, 7,800 dwt BBC Togo

The allegedly bit is apparently there because they cannot print without it as the people have not been convicted in a court of law - go figure

 

Also would you be ok with an attempted mugging where the mugger points a gun at you but is stopped by a cop and is then allowed to walk away as "no crime has been committed"

 

But attacks have occurred 800nm of the coast of Somalia - way outside their waters

 

Some of us have worked on commercial shipping and I tell you getting boarded is no fun, you wonder what the hell they will do, compare being boarded at sea in international waters with having a thug get into your car when you are stopped at the lights in town - is that ok?

Have been chased by 3 vessels in the Gulf of Aden and listened to a bunch of yachties screaming for help over the radio - we could hear gun fire - there was nothing we could do to help them as we were 4hrs steaming away.

 

Paint them anyway you like, but they do injure and kill people on a regular basis and not always within their economic zone (if you want to use that as justification), they are attacking vessels that have nothing to do with the illegal fishing, one yacht they attacked was 60nm from the Seychelles. Most of the shipping attacked has been passing through the area well off the coast, but then there is the shipping that is carrying aid supplies to Somalia, they attack them, seize them and want a ransom paid so that the vessels can unload the aid to Somalia in Somalia, freedom fighters fighting for their rights - yeah right - they are just trying to make some coin and now it appears that Islamic militants are training them.

 

Yes something needs to be done about the illegal fishing - I believe that the number of fishing vessels operating inside the territorial waters of Somalia has dropped significantly, but attacking any vessels other than the illegal fishing vessels is just a way to make money and hurt innocent people.

 

 

 

FYI - Piracy is not just in Somalia - just makes the news more often as they are more heavily armed and often more successful

 

Incident Details:

 

28.12.2009: 1610 UTC: Posn: 03:22S – 059:44E: Off Somalia.

Pirates attacked and hijacked a bulk carrier underway. The hijackers are sailing the vessel to Somali coast. Further reports awaited.

 

28.12.2009: 1449 UTC: Posn: 12:58N – 048:34E: Gulf of Aden.

Pirates attacked and hijacked a chemical tanker underway. The hijackers are sailing the tanker to an undisclosed location in Somalia. Further reports awaited.

 

28.12.2009: 1230 UTC: Posn: 01:04.7N – 103:38.5E: Singapore Straits.

About six small unlit boats chased a chemical tanker underway. Pirates from one boat attempted to board. The tanker made evasive manoeuvres and enforced anti piracy measures and prevented the boarding.

 

27.12.2009: 1230 LT: Posn: 08:28N – 061:01E: Off Somalia.

While underway, a container ship detected a white-hull fishing vessel with two small craft on each side. The fishing vessel lowered one craft, which chased the ship for around 45 minutes before aborting the attempt due to preventive measures.

 

28.12.2009: 0020 LT: Lagos anchorage, Nigeria.

Robbers armed with automatic weapons attacked and boarded an anchored general cargo ship. They assaulted and fire at the crew. Three-crew were injured. The robbers stole crew personal properties and ship’s stores and equipment. Master’s attempt to contact authorities and agents for assistance were futile. The IMB PRC received the distress message from the ship and relayed to the Nigerian authorities requesting to render assistance for the injured crew. At dawn, agents sent a boat to evacuate the injured crews’ to shore for medical treatment.

 

18.12.2009: Gulf of Aden.

Pirates attacked and hijacked a fishing vessel with its 15-crew members. The fishing vessel hull is red and white in colour. It is believed that the pirates may use it as a mother vessel to attack other vessels. All ships are advised to be cautious.

 

22.12.2009: 1710 UTC : Posn: 03:55.5N - 098:46.1E: Belawan anchorage, Indonesia.

Five robbers armed with knives boarded a container ship unnoticed. They tied-up the hands and feet of the duty AB and stole ship’s properties and ship’s stores. Alarm raised and crew alerted. Robbers escaped with stolen items. Incident reported to coastal authorities.

 

16.12.2009: 1700 LT: Posn: 02:45.70S – 042:37.11E, Off Somalia.

About nine pirates armed with guns in a small boat attacked, boarded and hijacked a dhow underway along with its 13 crewmembers.

 

15.12.2009: 0000 UTC: Posn: 05:38.8N – 000:02.9E, Tema roads, Ghana.

Ten robbers armed with machetes boarded a container ship at anchor via the anchor chain. They held three-duty crew, threatened them with the machetes at their throats and tied them up to bollards. The robbers stole ship’s property and stores from forward store and escaped. Port control informed. A patrol boat was sent to the location.

 

20.12.2009: 0345 LT: Posn: South of Tanjung Ayam, Singapore Straits.

Four robbers armed with long knives boarded a tug and took hostage the oiler. Alert duty AB saw the robbers and informed the duty officer who raised the alarm. Seeing the alert crew the robbers escaped with stolen ship’s stores.

 

18.12.2009: 1823 LT: Posn: 09:17.8N – 014:49.3W: Off Conakry, Guinea.

Pirates armed with machine guns in a speedboat approached and fired upon a chemical tanker drifting. The tanker, increased speed, enforced anti piracy measures, reported to authorities and prevented the pirates from boarding it. No injuries to crew.

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Once again I reiterate, none of those boats need to be there, they know the consequences, these pirates have found a niche to help feed their families, and it is the only way now they can do that.

I am not saying all pirates have that choice (East Asia for example, a lot of pirates are customs workers off duty) but I have sympathy for these Somalies.

Don't compare them to muggers etc, as these guys know they take their lives into their own hands each time they attack a ship.

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There is no right here is the problem. Pirates are still breaking the law. People should have the right to sail the waters they want to within the law. Other countries should not be able to rape and pillage any piece of ocean, let alone another countries international waters and take away food from the Starvings hand.

And if you can not go through those waters, how else do you get into the Med? Going around the bottom of Africa and up the West Coast is probably far more dangerous. As pointed out, Pirating is becoming a big issue world wide. Somalia is only a very small part of a much bigger Global issue.

 

Here is some further thought.

Of course, your No.1 priority is to protect your family. So if you are attacked, then you have the right to protect and I guess at whatever means available. But just remember, the Somali Fellow has the same right and he has already started life on the left foot. He has been born into a world of Starvation, Poverty and Death. That puts him on slightly ahead of all the rest of us in the fact that he wants to protect his family.

So what is the real answer???

Countries need to get together and sort the situation from the opposite end of the problem. Gvt needs to restored and people need to be fed. But to do it properly, the truth can not be kept undercover.

Sadly everyone is out for themselves. Hence the countries taking advantage by fishing the waters to extinction. America went in to Somalia not to sort the country out like was alluded to, but to try and stabilize the region so they could ensure a stable supply of oil. But once again, the truth was under cover. When that happens and you go into such a place to fight a battle no one is really clear on, you end up with no clear objective, no clear enemy and you lose, or pull out with a job half complete, because the objective was not what the World thought they were there for in the first place.

Here's a thought, a great man once said, "If a Man asks for your Coat, Give him your Shirt too". That kind of thinking makes for a substantial personal test.

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Once again I reiterate, none of those boats need to be there, they know the consequences, these pirates have found a niche to help feed their families, and it is the only way now they can do that.

I am not saying all pirates have that choice (East Asia for example, a lot of pirates are customs workers off duty) but I have sympathy for these Somalies.

Don't compare them to muggers etc, as these guys know they take their lives into their own hands each time they attack a ship.

 

So you are happy for some of our exports and imports to become more expensive, for greater carbon emissions.

I almost agree with you in regards to pleasure vessels but the "right" of innocent passage is being violated.

Two wrongs (illegal fishing and piracy) do not make a right - then again it depends on if you count assault, kidnapping, murder as wrongs, and the pirates do a fair amount of those.

 

Maybe the military forces need to start sinking the illegal fishing vessels - perhaps international agreements on harvesting of marine life, a requirement to land catches at the nearest country to where the catch is made, that'd screw the Japanese whalers, vessels in breach of the rules to be seized and turned over to the country nearest to where the catch was made.

 

Until you have been on the receiving end you do not know how it feels to be a victim of piracy or even attempted piracy.

 

Wheels, I agree something needs to be done to balance things out, unfortunately the last 30years has not improved much for certain countries in Africa, there is still starvation in many countries even with all the billions of supposed aid poured in there, maybe food aid is not the way, maybe infrastructure projects that generate food, wealth, educate and health improvements are needed, then again that all needs to be done in the correct cultural context, look at Zimbabwe, it was an exporter of food, now it cannot support/feed its people, what changed?

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yep hence my comment about working from the other end. Pouring aid in to a poor country is gains very little. Often the food gets confiscated before it reaches those in need. We have to keep sending food or even the lucky few will miss out also. But far more has to be done in a completely different way. But sadly I doubt it will ever happen. As long as countries like the US and hey, even us, anyone for that matter that are lucky enough to have food on their table and a roof over their head, as long as they have that, then they are rich in the eyes of Billions who don't. We are the top 10% of the worlds wealth remember. And that smart fellow I quoted before made yet another interesting comment. "For those that much has been given, Much is required". I'm preaching as much to myself as anyone here. We have to keep giving ourselves a slap evey now and then to remember that even when we think things are tuff and we are down, we are a billion times better off than a hell of a lot of people out there in the world.

But it will never change. It's the way of the world. Sadly. It has always been so and always will be so.

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Umm???... Let me think...

 

 

Carbon Emmissions from a dingy versus a ship?... 1 nill to the Somali's

 

Somali's fighting for thier livelihood and lives versus a commercial ship bring Crusoe's and riggers new HDMI 10000 inch plasma and iphone?.... 2 nil to the somalis!

 

 

A few random somali's 800miles out to sea in a useless Punt Versus a superliner 800miles out to see with the rich and famous "Punters" generating huge on board pollution and miles out of thier "economic zone"?.... 3 nil to the somalis.

 

4 somali's in a dingy with nothing to eat versus 1000 fat tossers in a cruise ship with every "plastic wrapped" food item to fill thier "over indulged guts???.... 5 nil to the somali's

 

poor old crusoe! sad to see his Million inch plasma (the one that will be outdated in 6 months) may be $20 more expensive while the poor somalis "bleed plasma" to survive!

 

Get ya head out of ya wallet and ya designer jeans and have some empathy with thier situation.

 

Imagine if you were treated like they have been.

 

If some one worse of than me stole my stuff i would not care. but is some one better of than me did it i would care!

 

Get the picture now?

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