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Maritime NZ not investigating the Gypsy incident


Dagwood

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f*ck John, you really are an outspoken twerp! For someone that has achieved and contributed so little, you seem to have a huge amount of negative comments to say about groups of people that do a huge amount for yachting in NZ.

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f*ck John, you really are an outspoken twerp! For someone that has achieved and contributed so little, you seem to have a huge amount of negative comments to say about groups of people that do a huge amount for yachting in NZ.

 

And now another one of these cat fights has arisen ... :silent:

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The moral outrage and indignation against Charlie Brown is pretty pointless...
I think that working out WHY it happened through an appropriate accident investigation and using the lessons to educate boaties and prevent future collisions would be far more useful.

My moral outrage is actually on precisely this point - why MNZ refuse to investigate.

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What has stopped MSA investigating stuff in the past :?: NOTHING :!:

 

Same with all sorts of Wellington bureaucrats.

 

So why now :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:

 

Compare this to the good work the SPCA does and their court cases when animals are just mistreated.

 

Here a person nearly drowns and has spent months suffering as well as having their pride and joy classic yacht sunk.

 

I wonder what would happen should the CEO of the MSA suddendly found their car had been fire bombed :?: Not suggesting this would happen you understand but the level of investigation would be serious, possibly way out of proportion relatively.

 

Has the Auckland Harbourmasters investigation been made public as a report :?: I don't know but would definately like to read some detailed official report.

 

By comparision, the Classicque / ferry near-mis had major reports and court actions. There is/was a thread with a lot of comments here.

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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/artic ... d=10794413

 

A father who watched in horror as his 4-year-old daughter plunged into the sea from a ferry docking at Coromandel is angrily demanding answers from the boat's operators.

 

 

 

Poppy was taken to a nearby medical centre where she was treated for a head cut and bruising, and scratches on her back and shoulders.

 

Andrew, a consultant from from Westmere, Auckland, said he was fuming that he still hadn't had satisfactory answers about what happened from operators 360 Discovery since the mid-January incident.

 

"This could have had a very different and tragic outcome and I don't want this to happen to any other family," he said.

 

A spokeswoman for Auckland-based 360 Discoveries told the Herald on Sunday an investigation was under way and that a ramp was not in use because of the tide. "We are glad Poppy is recovering well from her ordeal."

 

Maritime New Zealand said it was also investigating.

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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10794413

 

A father who watched in horror as his 4-year-old daughter plunged into the sea from a ferry docking at Coromandel is angrily demanding answers from the boat's operators.

 

 

 

Poppy was taken to a nearby medical centre where she was treated for a head cut and bruising, and scratches on her back and shoulders.

 

Andrew, a consultant from from Westmere, Auckland, said he was fuming that he still hadn't had satisfactory answers about what happened from operators 360 Discovery since the mid-January incident.

 

"This could have had a very different and tragic outcome and I don't want this to happen to any other family," he said.

 

A spokeswoman for Auckland-based 360 Discoveries told the Herald on Sunday an investigation was under way and that a ramp was not in use because of the tide. "We are glad Poppy is recovering well from her ordeal."

 

Maritime New Zealand said it was also investigating.

 

Doesn't sound serious enough to warrant an investigation.

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How about a simple "official report" to show that:

 

1. How it happened.

 

2. What the skipper saw & did.

 

3. What the crew saw & did.

 

4. Any lessons learned or was it just an accident.

 

I don't mind if it was "just an accident" e.g. the overactive girl simply slipped in a small puddle of water on the deck, slid under the gate / hand rails / lifelines and splash.

 

Things do happen, especially with kids, active, wanting to see everything, going here, there, everywhere etc. and back yet again and again all within 2 seconds.

 

So as long as all things were in their normal position and working OK, then that would be a good result.

 

If not, why not :?:

 

FYI my daughter swing from the playhouse on the jungle bars in our backyard badly broke her arm, seriously so that she might have lost a lot of movement. She does not play hand/ball games e,g, tennis but has done a lot of swimming that a doctor thought she might never be able to do.

OK the playground was all OK, No faults found. my daughter had slimply slipped by trying to jump/swing from "a monkey bar to far".

Rather like the allies in WWII. So it was self inflicted by an active girl pushing her own physical limits, exploring and learning.

 

Things can simply "happen". It might be so in the example of the girl going overboard, and if so, that is a suitable conclusion and everybody is happy with out needing to blame somebody.

:thumbup:

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Correct.

Things do happen and it would be nice to know that all reasonable steps had been taken.

 

Certainly legislation won't stop people climbing fences etc.

 

Argueably it cou;d be said that too many children are over protected these days and are losing the spirit of adventure, exploring and pushing their own imaginations, physical and mental limits.

 

I would be happy for a straight forward honest answer that might be:

 

The skipper, crew and investigators cannot find or see any faults or improvements.

The young girl cannot rtemember how it happened.

No further action taken nor recommended.

 

Simple and honest.

:thumbup:

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I think it is important what we would want from an official investigation:

 

- a conclusion about the incident, ie who did what?

- identify who was at fault and how they broke the rules?

- consider revision to laws, eg speed limit in harbour, lookout requirements, distance between boats, licencing of skippers etc

- punishment

 

The first two should be straightforward. The next two are much more difficult. Changing laws will be followed by howls of protest from everyone. How many pipe up when there is talk of a drivers licence for skippers? Would that even make any different.

 

I'm not bothered about punishment in this case. The guy stuffed up, there were signficant consequences, he seems to be remorseful about this actions. Would going further and taking him to court really make much difference to any of the affected parties?

 

All this comes back to what we really expect of the authorities in cases like this, or controlling the actions of many in general. There will always be comprimises, just depends on which ones we find acceptable.

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By the way, I think this incident is completely different from race yachts colliding. I've been on s34 several times when we have hit or been hit be another s34. In those cases, the s34 is built so strongly that sinking is unlikely but there is still a risk of injury. Not much fun, but rarely life threatening. In that case, you are also talking about people who are willing to have close battles in a race. If you are preparing to sail close to others, than be prepared to be hit now and then.

 

Very different if the boat you are in is less strong or hit by something that causes more damage, or out for a pleasant cruise on the harbour.

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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10794413

 

A father who watched in horror as his 4-year-old daughter plunged into the sea from a ferry docking at Coromandel is angrily demanding answers from the boat's operators.

 

 

 

 

If you were the parent of a 4 year old would you not be holding her hand or restraining her in some way if she was close to danger? Especially during docking procedures. I would think the girl should be "angrily demanding answers" from Dad.

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