johnMi 2 Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I Still don't know who this boatbuilder is. But then I guess I'm not that quick at putting no's together, or did I miss something Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I'm going to name someone!! "Peter" at 1/2 Moon Bay did work for me on my hull and keel. Came in on budget at the price he quoted and from all appearances, a job well done. Not all boat builders are "shonky"!! Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 It is one reason why I don't like the idea of name and shame. It is unfair on the other party if they have no way of reply. Several of us know who, but I suggest the name remains unsaid. And as already said, yes there are always two sides to a story. However!!!! this kind of story is being heard more and more. So if any lesson can be taken from it, Contractors need to be more diligent in ensuring all work is more transparent and that some form of simple contract is signed. To protect themselves as much as anything. The Customer has so many rights and in many respects, rights stacked very much in their favor. So both parties need to protect themselves so these kind of stories become less heard of. The attitudes of yards needs to change also. These contractors need to realise that boaties are struggling finacialy more and more. Just because you own a boat does not automatically mean you have huge wades of cash you are struggling to stuff into your pockets. Link to post Share on other sites
southernman 73 Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 But the right of reply should be given before slagging them off. Has anyone let him know officially this is going on? As a business owner this is the kind of stuff that really pisses me off - slagging in the media without first taking the appropriate steps to complain to an ombudsman? If you had a problem does the marine industry have a body that regulates these kind of disputes? Surely that would be the best arena to take this argument? There are always two sides to the story and I'm sure everyone on here thinks they are right but I'd also love to see the builder explain what is up. Agree there are dodgy builders out there - actually many of them you could class as cowboys but many good guys too who provide quality workmanship but at a price. By the way to stop arguments I'm not taking sides just observations so no personal attacks by the thompson twins please. (my new name for the two usual people on here). Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 He is very much aware of this forum. I have been contacted by his lawyer and removed any posts that might lead to identifying the person. It seems it is going to go to court and we will be able to watch with interest.. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Dan - am I correct that once there is a court decision there's no problem? Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Has anyone let him know officially this is going on? The Poster "Whetu" works for the Gentleman. Interestingly Mr Ogre will be jointly and severally liable in libel for publishing if Mr Bum's account turns out to be inaccurate (just noticed his post) so he may not be willing to risk Mr Bum's word on it! In regards to a Bulletin Board, that is not totally correct. Mr Squid is not directly responsible for what any poster may state. Link to post Share on other sites
boatbum 0 Posted November 13, 2012 Author Share Posted November 13, 2012 Well, it looks like this thread has kicked off again... To answer a few questions that have been raised by Whetu... And yes, i do suspect that Whetu does have an association with the BB, as only those there could have known the details of some of the things he said. So..... Why quote a job at $13,000 knowing that you are going to charge well in excess of that? Why "condition" the owner that the price might go to maybe 15 or 20k from the minute it is moved into the shed? Why not listen to the owner that states very clearly "i'm working to a budget and cant afford any over-runs? Why was the job done on a "charge up" basis, as opposed to the quote? if so what was the quoted part and what was the "extras" part??? Why was there no mention of "extra's" or a price given for them for approval? Why did a 2 week job take more than 6 weeks? Why, If the job was "at a very good price" was it not complete, finished on time or to satisfactory standard ? (i can post photo's if you like!) Why am i not alone with having issues with this BB? Why, just because the owner is working on his boat along side others contracted to do a job does that make him "project manager" and responsable for the job and its costs? Why does a job quoted at 13k actually cost 41k.... then still need about 6k worth of finishing??? And dont give me any cr*p about wanting to have the boat for Labour weekend then bringing it back to be finished... what??? and then be charged another 20k to finish it!!! hell no, i just wanted my boat back before you got to 100k!!! Yes, there are 2 sides to every story, i'm glad we've heard yours! I am more than happy to continue discussing this with you on here, and as you are "the other party" then surely that is licence to be a bit more specific in regard to what is said on here????? discussing this Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 however this is a very unsettled area of the law so if a recent case or law change has occurred, Correct, it's a very unsettled area of law. It needs to have a few cases to go through court (in NZ that is) to hammer out some clear understanding/rulings. So far there have been none, so no actual clear rulings from Judges. Even dotcom is in a similar situation. It is easy to argue either side of a case, but till such a case goes to court, is argued and then a Judge lays down Legal rulings/findings, there will always remain the arguments on both sides. Yes, a few of us know Whetu is an employee. As I and MB and several others have said though, leaving the Honesty/Dishonesty arguments out of the situation, the CGA clearly gives the greater power/protection to the Customer. Whether the Customer is right or wrong, the Contractor must have all their ducks in order these days. You can have all the signs on the wall that you like that may state your terms of trade, but in reality, many of those signs are meaningless because the CGA is the only law. Contractors need to get themselves better versed with that law. It has been on existance for many many years now and yet it is stunning how many still do not know or understand it. Link to post Share on other sites
too_tall 15 Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Guys, really, this thread should not exist. Boatbum, keep yourself out of the public eye if your getting your lawyer to attempt to resolve the issue. Don't give the builder's lawyer any ammunition to counter your claims with, or to defer attention to anything other than where it should be. Once things are sorted, come back with the results of the resolution unless as part of the settlement you have to sign a non disclosure statement. Link to post Share on other sites
Mothership 6 Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 To the original poster, if lawyers are involved as mentioned, it is best this thread does not continue. The legal process should focus on the facts of the case, not distractions such as this. [edit] Exactly what he said ^^[/edit] Link to post Share on other sites
johnMi 2 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 I'm still interested, and whoever wants to keep posting, I'll still read it. Link to post Share on other sites
Farrari 4 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Guys, really, this thread should not exist. Boatbum, keep yourself out of the public eye if your getting your lawyer to attempt to resolve the issue. Don't give the builder's lawyer any ammunition to counter your claims with, or to defer attention to anything other than where it should be. Once things are sorted, come back with the results of the resolution unless as part of the settlement you have to sign a non disclosure statement. +1 While we are very interested to know the outcome, the public nature of this is unlikley to help your cause. Link to post Share on other sites
Old Salty 0 Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 There is enough info on the various postings for me to know with certainty who this fellow is that all the buzz is about. He would without doubt be one of the most unscrupulous business person I have ever dealt with. My lawyer did a search on him and he has been a director of more than 10 failed companies. His way of getting business is to quote a reasonable price to do the work specified by the owner and "Hello" when we opened up the baot we have found all these faults that need fixing and frustrates the customer by avoiding to quote a price to make the repair. He will often do work without even consulting the owner and then refuse to release the boat until such time as the bill is paid. I was speaking to the owner of a boat called Seaquil which is on my marina about some work he had done on his boat. It was quite impressive. He told me who had done it and warned me not to use this guy as he had been charged for things he specifically asked to be excluded. He said he didn't pay but that he was protected by a contract. Its is a pity that no one can name him as it spoils the industry for other BB and especially for the other BB shareing the same complex. Link to post Share on other sites
TrinaD 0 Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 I think you guys are just a bunch of backyard bullies who have nothing better to do than pick on people that are trying to make an honest living to feed their families! Did anyone stop to ask whether Boatbum actually got a written signed quote for $13,000, or whether he had a signed contract for the same. You must realise that boats are a luxury item, they are not a necessity and if you cannot afford to pay for repairs on them then you shouldn't have one. The boatbuilder in question has no doubt has been burnt many times by people who want something for nothing! Big deal if it takes six weeks to do the job, I would think that is a dam good timeframe in the boating industry. I bet that boatbuilder slaves away seven days a week dealing with all the crap that goes along with people like boatbum instead of actually getting the job done! Link to post Share on other sites
RushMan 31 Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 $41,000 for six weeks worth of work? $6,000+ per week Someone is being taken for a ride. Link to post Share on other sites
tuffyluffy 76 Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 I think you guys are just a bunch of backyard bullies who have nothing better to do than pick on people that are trying to make an honest living to feed their families! Did anyone stop to ask whether Boatbum actually got a written signed quote for $13,000, or whether he had a signed contract for the same. You must realise that boats are a luxury item, they are not a necessity and if you cannot afford to pay for repairs on them then you shouldn't have one. The boatbuilder in question has no doubt has been burnt many times by people who want something for nothing! Big deal if it takes six weeks to do the job, I would think that is a dam good timeframe in the boating industry. I bet that boatbuilder slaves away seven days a week dealing with all the crap that goes along with people like boatbum instead of actually getting the job done! Link to post Share on other sites
morspeed 1 Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 I think you guys are just a bunch of backyard bullies who have nothing better to do than pick on people that are trying to make an honest living to feed their families! Did anyone stop to ask whether Boatbum actually got a written signed quote for $13,000, or whether he had a signed contract for the same. You must realise that boats are a luxury item, they are not a necessity and if you cannot afford to pay for repairs on them then you shouldn't have one. The boatbuilder in question has no doubt has been burnt many times by people who want something for nothing! Big deal if it takes six weeks to do the job, I would think that is a dam good timeframe in the boating industry. I bet that boatbuilder slaves away seven days a week dealing with all the crap that goes along with people like boatbum instead of actually getting the job done! I think you will actually find us "guys" are just a bunch of sailors who expect a fair price for a fair job. When some one quotes me a verbal figure, that figure is expected to be held unless notified otherwise. Methinks you are a wife/mistress or even the mother of said boatbuilder and i congratulate you on such a endearing first post, looking forward to warming you up and hearing what you really think!. Link to post Share on other sites
banaari 27 Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 (...) boats (...) are not a necessity (...) Umm, bullshit! Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted November 30, 2012 Share Posted November 30, 2012 Did anyone stop to ask whether Boatbum actually got a written signed quote for $13,000, or whether he had a signed contract for the same. He does not have to. Verbal quoting still holds, but the law is on the side of the Client, not the Contractor. It is up to the Contractor to ensure his Client signs a Quote. If he didn't, then that is his problem. You must realise that boats are a luxury item, they are not a necessity and if you cannot afford to pay for repairs on them then you shouldn't have one. This here in high lights the problem. If this is the attitude of the Boating Industry, then it is not wonder we have such a problem in the Industry. If it is the attitude of the Boat Biulder in Question, then no wonder he has such a reputation. That is the age old piss poor attitude of, "He owns a Boat, therefore he must be wealthy." And if you have that attitude, then you shouldn't have a Business. Link to post Share on other sites
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