Auckland Seaplanes

[Infinity 1]

Sure Chris will respond but believe the Aircraft is charged out at $1500/hr

 

Seats 7 + Pilot

 

Approx 20mins to Kawau (oneway).

[Guest]

After having a chat with a learned mate who knows stuff about operations like this, I think some have ideas about it that may be a little off track. The below is a little speculative as I'm knot any of the players involved but I think we'll find it'll work something like this.

 

This is aircraft related so the powers that be will be the CAA, Civil Aviation Authority or as they are known to many at the moment, the Civil Aviation Arseholes. That's due to MASSIVE fee increases* for all things flying related but that's another shocking story of Govt wankery.

 

So the Akl Seaplane guys will have to comply with all the CAA rules like all aircraft in NZ do. One/some of those dictate when and how you can take-off or land. The most known to all pilots is NO taking off or landing when ANYTHING is on the runway. Anything can be a can of beer thru to the QE2. As these aircraft will use a water runway I reckon they will be running some programme that their 'runway' will be a area of say, 500mts by 100mts wide. I'm guessing there as it will depend on the aircraft's performance figures. So if we assume my guess is correct that means if the pilot is about to take off or land and can't find a clear space of that size it just won't happen and they will have to go to plan B or location B. So with that in mind I kan't see how aircraft and boats can come close together UNLESS it's a wayward boatie who has a very fast vessel.

 

The CAA are right pricks, just like MNZ, and only waht to find blame, be there any or knot, should a incident occur. The Pilots will know this so unless they are dickheads, and there is zero suggestion they are, they will know if they feck up even in the small slightest they will be pinged and that can easily mean lose of licence meaning job and career gone. Also I don't know any pilots with a death wish so unless some secretive dude, maybe by the name of Osama Von Biggles, gets a job there and decided to do a hail Mary into the first S34 that sails past I doubt we will see the pilots busting what are very strict and well enforced laws.

 

But when the floats are on the water the aircraft can be regarded as a boat, remembering if there is any incident while on the water the CAA will still dive in, just as they do with all ground incidents be they at WhataPhuka airstrip or Akl International Airport. Again guessing a little here but I suspect the Harbour master would regard the aircraft as just another fast boat and as it's commercial I'd guess the HM would have to allow some exemption for it to conduct it's business. By that I mean there will be a few seconds on take off and landing when the aircraft exceed 12knts. So I'd be thinking they will have or be after an exemption for that speed just as other commercial vessels on the harbour can get and have got.

 

Note here that the aircraft will only be exceeding 12kts for some seconds, knot minutes and knot even one minute. I don't know the Beaver specs but based in a similar older heavish aircraft I fly I'm gonna guess take off at 65 knots so maybe 15-20 seconds at a speed above 12knts, possibly knot even that long. The moment the floats lift clear of the water nothing maritime applies anymore.

 

Now suss the harbour. I could go onto it now and drive a 747 up it and touch nothing. I could do that probably 98% of the time on the harbour. Sure I wouldn't be booking a flight on Anniversary Day or the odd other day but as a general rule the harbour is huge and empty, baring in mind they only need 500 odd mts of clear space for 30 seconds, there abouts.

 

So when you consider the rules the aircraft must work under, the emptiness of the harbour, the desire of the pilots to go home to their families at the end of the day, the small space the aircraft need and for such a very short amount of time, I am struggling to see what the angst is all about.

 

The noise and as someone earlier posted 'noise and privacy for Princess wharf'... hello you live in the middle of a 1 million people, a million people make noise. Get the f*ck over it or move to the Auckland Islands. As for the privacy call, from someone living within 100mts of 1000's of CCTV cameras????? Hello!!!!

 

As noted the above is educated guesses made by some pilots (of which I'm one) knowing the rules and regs. It's knot definitive so don't bother using it in front of a judge, unless he/she lives on Princess Wharf in which case just tell them to get realistic.

 

* - some in excess of 500%.

[MarkMT 68]

Well said.

[seaplanes 0]

Hello all,

 

As advised yesterday, below a draft procedure to ensure that the training and racing activities around in the harbour are not affected by our activities. This procedure has been drafted with input from staff at the RNZYS, for which we are very grateful. It has been forwarded to the Commodores of RNZYS, PCC and RYC for comments and also been passed on to AYBA for distribution to other clubs. Obviously we would follow the same procedure for races of other clubs, should they come close to our proposed operating area.

 

The procedure is a 2nd draft and open for further input. DRAFT 22.08.2013

 

Operating Procedure of Auckland Seaplanes around Racing and training activities of Royal New Zealand Yacht Squadron, Ponsonby Cruising Club and Richmond Yacht Club

 

Auckland Seaplanes wants to ensure that there is minimal impact of its operation on the racing and training activities of nearby sailing clubs. It is therefore planning its operations around published racing times by AYBA and it is proposed

1. Auckland Seaplanes will list all races in its diaries and plan around these activities

2.The outer starting buoy is approximately 600 meters outside of the proposed operating area. For races starting from there, Auckland Seaplanes aircraft will not come closer than 700 meters to the starter buoy within 20 minutes of the start of racing.

3.For races starting from a committee boat, which may be located outside the operating area (e.g. Club Marine Wednesday and Winter Series races). Auckland Seaplanes will operate in an area east of the western side of the entrance to Westhaven. This is expected to provide a clearance from the start line of more than 500 meters.

4.Auckland Seaplanes will contact the relevant club to confirm the race course for the race and monitor race progress in the operating area from its office.

5.During the race Auckland Seaplanes will not come closer than 3oo meters for Take-Off and Landing to the bulk of the fleet and remain standard separation from all other vessels participating in the race.

6.During short course races/training a minimum of 200 meters separation from the outermost sailing boat will be maintained for Take off and landing.

This procedure will be reviewed after one month of start of operations and thereafter in mutually agreed time intervals.

 

We very much hope that this procedure helps to further allay any concerns.

 

There have been lots of rumours around our intended operations in the last 6 weeks, and for any lack in communication from our part we apologize.

Auckland Seaplanes was offered assistance with the engagement process with other water users by one Council Controlled Organisation in July, however, this did not eventuate and then the emails and rumours started flying. Unfortunately we weren’t contacted in that process while still awaiting the offered assistance. But we want to move on from there.

 

I attach a picture, which was taken on Monday from our intended base and gives a good perspective of what the traffic on the harbour (outside racing times) is like on a beautiful day at our typical operating times.

 

Again, I am available for any further questions at any time by email or on the phone, or while watching some of the AC racing over the coming weeks at the RNZYS.

 

Thank you, Chris

[Deep Purple 511]

That sounds fair and reasonable, thanks

[Guest]

Oh, I'm a reasonably good guesser and it seems Alk Seaplanes have gone even further than what the regulations desire of them, purely it seems to ensure they don't piss off boaters.

 

Nice work Chris. I wish you well.

[Chewing Gum 17]

Those Beavers are cool machines, have only flown in once from Ardmore to Parakai and it reminded me of being in a 38 Chev, they just trundle along. They are still popular in the American northwest and in fact some have been re-exported that way from NZ.

[Bradz 18]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAX-lHnNmuo

 

A very cool look at Vancouver and the Seaplanes that operate there..

[SloopJohnB 323]

Note the double stacked containers on the train.

[Guest]

So once the western entrance is blocked off at Westhaven and all the boats, paddle boarders, disabled sailors, super yachts and waka-ama guys are using the soon-to-be-reduced eastern entrance will there be enough room for the seaplane to use this alternative facility?

As I understand it this is the contingency mooring location during periods of adverse winds?

 

Personally I think it's a great idea and hope it takes off (snigger snigger) but would like to know if the Westhaven eastern entrance has been included in any draft planning.

 

My personal feeling is that this entrance is going to become very tight very quickly.

[seaplanes 0]

Good evening,

 

First of all to Sundreamer/Phil: Thanks very much for listening to our arguments and proposals! We really appreciate that you kept an open mind. One request though. If you have provided input to any process/regulatory body, we would be very grateful if you could update that input based on your current understanding of our plans and processes.

 

To Shakeme : I know entry into Westhaven is raised as a possible concern, please let me restate our policy on that.

 

As soon as our planned base is operational, we only intend to taxi once in the morning out of Westhaven and back in the evening. I attach a map of the taxi route and space available. Obviously as a "power driven vessel" we will follow the regulations regarding taxiing speed, right of way rules, including the regulations in regard to giving way to non-powered vessels etc.

 

Our Standard Operating Procedures states that

 

- for entry into every marina with a channel width of less than 50 meters or where potential for significant traffic (like Westhaven) exists, we will have a support boat or other observation mechanism available. Should the channel not be clear the aircraft will hold back outside or not leave the pontoon.

- we also do not intend to enter further into Westhaven than the superyacht berths. (The blue line in the picture is just drawn to show where we are going, not actual path (off course we will keep to starboard side, pass port/port).

 

I will update the measurements for the fairway having just seen the plans for Y pier in the next few days. My last info from WA was that the blocking of the western exit of Westhaven is likely to be 2-3 years away at least. Off course this could change if the AC comes back, but we will use this time to plan and develop other berthing/storage options.

 

To Vorpal Blade: I am in discussions with Billy Walsh from the Squadron about planning access to Kawau and as soon as we have done our trial flights, I will put more information on the web.

 

Otherwise, thanks to the rest of the community for the largely positive feedback on our intended operations over the last few weeks!

 

I wanted to share with you the updated procedure, which we are proposing around the sailing/training events of the Westhaven Clubs. This is open for comment and will be reviewed as we gain practical experience

 

DRAFT 11.09.2013

 

Standard Operating Procedure of Auckland Seaplanes Limited to harbour and sailing events on Auckland harbour.

1. Auckland Seaplanes Limited (ASL) wants to ensure that there are no adverse impacts of its operations on the harbour and sailing activities of nearby sailing clubs and other sporting organisations.

2. ASL will operate around racing times published by the Auckland Yacht & Boat Association (AYBA), which co-ordinates the centreboard and keelboat racing programme in the Auckland area.

3. In addition, ASL will recognize other harbour and sailing events of the Royal New Zealand Yacht Squadron, the Ponsonby Cruising Club, the Richmond Yacht Club which operate out of Westhaven, and any other activities advised to it by other clubs or sporting organisations and will operate around those events and activities.

4. ASL will list all races, harbour, sailing and other events and activities in its diaries and will plan its operations around those activities.

5. The outer starting buoy is approximately 600 meters outside ASL’s proposed operating area. For races starting from this outer starting buoy, ASL will maintain a minimum distance of 700 metres between its seaplanes and the starter buoy for a period of 20 minutes up to the start of racing.

6. Some races are started from a committee boat, which may be located outside ASL’s operating area (e.g. Club Marine Wednesday and Winter Series races). For these races, ASL will operate only in an area east of the western side of the entrance to Westhaven, maintaining a minimum distance of 500 metres between its seaplanes and the committee boat for a period of 20 minutes up to the start of racing.

7. At least 30 minutes prior to the start of a race, ASL will contact the relevant club to confirm the race course for the race and ASL will monitor race progress in ASL’s operating area from its office.

8. During a race, ASL will maintain a minimum separation distance of 300 metres for take-off and landing between the seaplane and the bulk of the fleet and will retain standard separation from all other vessels which are clearly participating in the race.

9. During notified short course races or training ASL will maintain a minimum of 200 metres separation for take-off and landing between the seaplanes and the outermost sailing boat.

10. This SOP will be reviewed one month after the start of operations in consultation with AYBA and the named yacht clubs, and thereafter in mutually agreed time intervals.

 

I hope that this addresses any remaining concerns and we look very much forward to working with the whole Westhaven community in an open and constructive way going forward.

 

And now let’s hope we can finish AC34 off tomorrow!

Cheers

Chris