wheels 543 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 KM, be very wary of flowcoating (if you are talking about Polyester Flow coat) inside water tanks. It will taint water for ages. Use Epoxy or Epoxy Undercoat made for below waterline. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Well thats rational isn't it. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I have epoxy flowcoat. Ahggggg... I just don't want bare timber as it is just an arse on many levels. A coat of anything has to be better than no coat at all. I have lots of resin so a coat of that in the unseen spots has to be better than no coats at all. We are talking the underside of bunks, lockers and the like, knot water tanks or structural places. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Bare ply would be fine KM in those situations. Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Wood will absorb up to 13% of it's own weight in moisture. Not to mention that it will warp, yes even Marine ply and it will be softer than when it is dry. And in KM's situation, if he takes on water and then pumps it out, but bare wood is now wet, it is going to be heavy and take much longer to dry. It is well worth sealing it. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 wrong again wheels. Link to post Share on other sites
Atom Ant 0 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Wow a pissing contest over glue - what next Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Yeah you're right AA. I will leave it at that. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 I reckon you ought to stop giving advice on stuff you obviously know very little about wheels. What you said about glue strength was wrong, plainly. timber won't absorb water like for ages, it gets wet then dries quickly. acting like a sponge it does not. Its obviously out of your area of expertise and you ought to admit it. Link to post Share on other sites
TimW 1 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 For what its worth. I too don't really like everdure for the reasons stated but I have always stuck with the same method given too me many years ago by Adhesive technologies as no one else has mentioned it. I use a 10-20% thinned epoxy coat first using #7 thinner. Allow about half hour minimum between coats then use Straight resin over the top of the still wet thinned coat. The ply will be almost as well sealed as two coats of straight resin which would be ideal, but this way you can put it on much faster. Its also pretty tough on the surface this way and reasonably smooth. As for the strength of Epoxy, the strength of room temperature cure Epoxies such as West system are a mere fraction of the strength achievable using modern Prepreg type Epoxy resins. Good luck with your job KM Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Saturday Night Special Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 What planet are you on BBay ,Having probably built more boats than you have seen I know wheels"s information is near enough to be correct for most applications, as for your unsealed PVA concepts I suggest you not use those or Chip board in a boat .Try bookcase bulding. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 That's close as damn it how it worked out in the end Tim. Had a bit of resin left over but it was just starting to kick off so a splash of N07 (hoping Jotun No7 is the same as West No7) and thru that everywhere then as the day progressed I wiped over all the left over straight resin. Looks good and it also leaves you with cleaner resin mixing pots Agree on the resins. PPP is using ATR for his new Jav and I'm just on bog std West 10 whatever. We did some playing the other day and even with only a 1/2 cook of the ATR is was way stronger. Wow a pissing contest over glue - what next I was just about to book them a Motel room Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 resorcinol requires better jointing but is a far stronger glue than epoxy properly applied, bare timber/ ply......never, not only are you dealing with moisture you're also faced with the salt it contains which stays there and.............holds moisture, won't rot, pickled and sort of preserves is the word my old man used but it still stays damp and holds a pong Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 What planet are you on BBay ,Having probably built more boats than you have seen I know wheels"s information is near enough to be correct for most applications, as for your unsealed PVA concepts I suggest you not use those or Chip board in a boat .Try bookcase bulding. oddly enough Chris McMullen and Eric Wing used a lot od chipboard in their earlier boats as mostly flooring and well soaked in everdure it has actually stood the test of time bloody well, floorboards on Panui for 20 odd years were 12mm bison board that were treated the same and suffered not at all Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 The big thing people get wrong is basically one coat of anything generally won't do it. How often have you seen black bleed into supposedly sealed timber. everdure will work if you applied enough to seal it - how many coats ? well is it sealed and varnish like ? Yes everdure can be a problem in winter when trying to apply too much and the overcoating before all the thinners has left. So the West way as Tim explained is safer and generally the second resin coat will seal everything. But it's all about the application. In some ways a light boat cloth is the answer as a resin carrier. If it's being painted I use a sanding sealer then durepox or epoxy primer Glues Urea-formaldehyde, Casin, Resorcinol, Epoxys all have/had there place In aviation all we are only allowed to typically use is resorcinol (aerodux ) with wood, nothing wrong with it other than as L4 say you need a neat/tight join. To say that it is better than epoxy would be difficult to argue. for The same joint and correctly mixed and extened epoxy you would struggle to prove weather it is better over the resorcinol. Epoxy has way more adeptness buy adding, and blending different extenders ( powders ) so people see it as the be all and end all. it certainly works out cheaper than resorcinol when buying small quantities Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Hi Gary - if I have a small amount of black bleed (didn't know it had a name!) what's the best thing - just bang some more coats over it? Not visible so just want to know it won't get worse. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Don't know the proper name, its basically water ingress gone stagnate or mouldy Give it a good sand and dry ( dehumidifier works well ) and re coat it Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Figured as much - thanks. Just a few spots in the bilge. Link to post Share on other sites
Dambo 44 Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Figured as much - thanks. Just a few spots in the bilge. It's a Spencer, a few spots in the bilge is going very well Link to post Share on other sites
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