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Buying first Keeler


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Hi all,

 

I am looking into buying my first Keeler. I have a modest budget of approx $25k, so maybe thinking of a boat around $20k with some money for the inevitable upgrades and maintainence.

 

I have experience with dinghy sailing and some trailer sailers though not extensive.

 

I hope to sail in the Wellington Harbour initially to gain some experience and familiarity with the boat with potential for possible Strait Crossings to the sounds with family of Partner and 2 children (9 and 11).

 

I would also like something that is able to be sailed single handed if possible.

 

I have been looking at something along the lines of a Raven 26 and would appreciate any input and advise.

 

Cheers

 

 

 

Jeff

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Hi Jeff,

 

A Raven 26 is a great boat for what you are talking about. Forgiving, reasonable performance for it's size, and very capable. You'll get a really good one for around 20k.

 

If Strait trips are on your agenda, you should consider Mana Cruising Club. It is a way easier trip across from there, normally a reach both ways, and only about 20 NM. Way shorter than from Wellington, and no wind factory to sail through...

 

My first keeler was a Raven 26, and we did a lot of strait crossings in her - my older daughter did her first at 6 weeks old - in the raven. Sailed mine around the North Island, and some have made international voyages. One in the Bay of Islands over summer has a junk rig ?? and is sailed by a well known woman with a lot of offshore miles (so I'm told, I don't know her).

 

Ravens are very strong, but liable, like most GRP boats of that era, to have the pox. It's not so serious (usually) on a Raven, as it is not cored, but solid GRP. That being said, find a nice one, and get a survey!

 

Best of luck

Matt

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The Ravin's are a good sea boat, but they don't have much room inside and have a very short water line so are slow

 

In your budget I would be looking at Mararuder 8.4 , lotus 9.2 and davidson 28 much faster more room and much nicer motion

 

 

eg

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-m ... 053067.htm

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-m ... 084920.htm

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-m ... 318979.htm

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Thanks Matt

 

One of the main reasons for the Wellington Harbour option was the ease of mooring at Seaview Marina and also the protection of Wellington Harbour in our prevailing winds in my "gaining experience phase". This is my perception of weather conditions and may not in fact be the case.

 

I was considering a pole mooring at Seaview Marina initially mainly on account of the cost (approx 100pm) as opposed to $400ish for a berth at Mana Marina.

 

I guess the couple of questions that spring to mind based on that are :

 

What is "Day Cruising" like out of Mana and are there any options for mooring at Mana other than the Marina?

 

Cheers

Jeff

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Hi Jeff,

 

Yes, there are pole moorings available - I used to use one for my Raven. Contact the Porirua Habourmaster. They used to be really cheap, but are now mostly empty - should be cheaper! A bit of a dingy ride out though - known as "Siberia" because of this...

 

There is a mooring just inside Mana island that club members can use (as well as the many moorings throughout the sounds). Day sailing is limited - out to Mana Island in NW, or down to Titahi Bay etc in SE. Kapiti Island etc worth a few trips as well, and don't forget the two little islands inside Kapiti. But it's only 4 hours to the sounds in a Raven! We used to go after work on a Friday, come home Sunday...

 

The Mana Cruising Club also runs fleet Strait Crossings several times a year for new or inexperienced members. I also know several members who would be happy to help with your first crossings if you want to go at another time.

 

The Raven is very roomy for a 26 ft boat, and will outsail the bilge keeler above. The 2nd link above will take way more than 5-10 k to make it a safe boat for the Strait...

 

Matt

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Outside of marinas there are swing moorings, some information here http://www.gw.govt.nz/Swing-moorings/

 

At Mana depending upon when you needed the mooring the easiest option for a would be at Onepoto. Draft wise you should be fine getting too and from there it is just a bit more distance to the open water.

 

If you want more information on moorings give me a call, work number is 830 4162

 

The pole moorings are looked after by a contractor for Porirua City Council, contact is Rick Gibson 029 770 0068

 

If you wanted to have a look over a Raven 26 I would get in touch with Lowry Bay Yacht Club, they have a few regularly sailing over there, at least one owner pops up on here too.

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Thanks again Matt and also w44vi

 

Obviously in the early stages of finding something and keen to get as much info as possible so thanks for the input :D

 

The idea of a four hour sail is very appealing, avoiding a lot of the Tidal problems I have read about going to the Sounds from Wellington Harbour.

 

Cheers

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Thanks for the info Grant, I will contact Rick Gibson over the next week.

 

Have found what looks to be a very good value Raven in Nelson

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing ... =649353304

 

I am heading down with work over the next couple of weeks so will arrange to have a look before deciding to proceed with a lift out and survey.

 

Anyone have any ideas on the approximate cost of a Survey for boat of this size?

 

Cheers

 

Jeff

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The survey I had done for my Raven 26 cost 3 hours of labour (1 hour travel, 1 hour with the hammer and an hour typing up the results). From memory $65 per hour. Plus I had to pay for the quick lift at the marina, which at Seaview cost is about $100. I should add to the the surveyor provided some excellent advice and suggestions to improve the boat.

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Well, I have gone and done it.....

 

I am now the proud owner of Tandara!

 

 

Tandara.jpg

 

Tandara Int.jpg

 

Tandara Cockpit.jpg

 

 

Presently in Marina in Motueka. I will be collecting on Friday and taking her to Nelson, spending the Weekend getting acquainted and will leave in Nelson for a month or so making a couple of trips down for the weekend to get to know her before looking at coming back across the strait.

 

After considering Mana as a mooring option, I have decided on Keeping her at Seaview for now.

 

I will, however arrange for someone with some strait experience to do the crossing with me.

 

Exciting times!

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She looks pretty tidy, well done! Ravens are a great first keeler.

 

If you want to cruise (rather than race range or day sail) then Mana is the better place - the sounds is in range on a Friday night, back on Sunday.

If you keep it in Wellington, the Sounds is a Looooong way away - not really worth it unless you have a week!

Good luck with the new boat!

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She looks pretty tidy, well done! Ravens are a great first keeler.

 

If you want to cruise (rather than race range or day sail) then Mana is the better place - the sounds is in range on a Friday night, back on Sunday.

If you keep it in Wellington, the Sounds is a Looooong way away - not really worth it unless you have a week!

Good luck with the new boat!

 

 

Cheers Matt

 

Thought long and hard about options for mooring and in the end decided on Seaview for at least the Winter which will give more opportunity to really get to know the boat with greater opportunities for some day sailing in and around Wellington Harbour and some round the cans fun! Towards the end of Winter, will probably reassess with view to getting a bit further afield!

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Had a fantastic first, albeit short first trip on Friday, from Motueka to Nelson, lovely 12-15 knt Nor West sea Breeze, cruising along at around 5 knots.

 

Had some fun berthing in Nelson though, just as I turned off the main passage into the row of Marina Berths, engaged reverse to slow down, went to give the motor a few revs to find the throttle cable had broken, fortunately in the idle position!

 

Managed to get close enough to the dock to step off and pull her into position without falling in , crashing into someone or too much bad language!

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Hi Jeff,

All good! As a general rule, it's a good idea to test fwd and rev just outside a marina - Every time!. It does not prevent every incident (like your broken cable) but is good practice. We do it when we turn to weather to take in the mainsail...

 

What's the next leg? Nelson to Queen Charlotte? Make sure you get the correct tide times for French Pass. Go thru with the tide (you won't make it against it anyway) just as it starts to run is the easiest. You can do it at full flow as well, watch out for the strong eddies - they are not dangerous it you are in the middle, but can cause a rapid change in heading!!

 

Matt

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Hi Jeff,

All good! As a general rule, it's a good idea to test fwd and rev just outside a marina - Every time!. It does not prevent every incident (like your broken cable) but is good practice. We do it when we turn to weather to take in the mainsail...

 

What's the next leg? Nelson to Queen Charlotte? Make sure you get the correct tide times for French Pass. Go thru with the tide (you won't make it against it anyway) just as it starts to run is the easiest. You can do it at full flow as well, watch out for the strong eddies - they are not dangerous it you are in the middle, but can cause a rapid change in heading!!

 

Matt

 

Went through the testing as I came into the Marina.... if I had not of done might have lasted long enough for me to dock....lol!!! Thats the way it goes I suppose!

 

I plan to have another weekend around Nelson soon just to get used to her will then plan the trip back over a couple of days Nelson to Queen Charlotte then home to Wellington....

 

Anyone keen on a trip? would appreciate an experienced head for the crossing!

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What's the next leg? Nelson to Queen Charlotte? Make sure you get the correct tide times for French Pass. Go thru with the tide (you won't make it against it anyway) just as it starts to run is the easiest. You can do it at full flow as well, watch out for the strong eddies - they are not dangerous it you are in the middle, but can cause a rapid change in heading!!

 

Matt

 

Tides or Flows? I know Matt knows a lot more than me about the area but I found it quite confusing. Don't make the mistake that I did when initially planning my trip that the flows through French Pass related to the Tides in the area, they don't. The flows through French Pass change during the tide, varying quite a bit. Luckily I found the correct answer before I went

i.e. High Tide in Nelson this evening is at 8pm but French Pass changes direction at 7:18pm. But that can move around a lot. Also in Auckland each tide changes pretty regularly half an hour per cycle, in Nelson two high tides can be within minutes of each other (12 hours apart) with the low an hour apart, then cycling the other way. Very confusing to us Gulfers.

 

http://www.linz.govt.nz/hydro/tidal-info/tidal-streams/french-pass

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