too_tall 15 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 There are significant differences: a) It it reasonably cost-effective to police the speed limit The road toll is measured in HUNDREDS of deaths per year, not the single-digit figures that MIGHT be attributable to not wearing a life jacket c) An idiot exceeding the speed limit and crashing stands a good chance of injuring someone else in the process. There are significant differences, but its still the same concept that there is a law in place that is really there only for a select few idiots, and it penalises the rest of us. In the case of the speed limit, it also gathers revenue, but its still very similar. It would be interesting to see how many hours per death there are from boating vrs cars. I suspect that boating might be worse. Link to post Share on other sites
idlerboat 116 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 ....it is about life jackets....its the only way you can help stop idiots from dying.....and some unlucky not idiots.. you cant use the law to cull the idiot gene....you can only use it to make them wear a life jacket...... Dead is dead....much as we may make light of it......dead is actually dead. Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 No you are not understanding my point IB. The real reason why most of the incidents we have seen (in NZ at least) is due to people taking stupid risks. Umm, actually risk is not the right word either, because they haven't considered the situation risk wise at all. They are people that have done plain stupid dumb things. Wearing, or in their case, not wearing a lifejacket has only been part of the stupidity of the event. A lifejacket may or may not have helped save them, but the main point is, they should never have gone out in the first place. They have to understand that wearing a lifejacket will not make their Boat seaworthy, nor make them immune to the conditions they go out in, nor make them able to walk on water and command the waves to calm. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Having been involved in a couple of fruitless searches for these "idiots", the saddest thing was that the families didn't even get a body back to provide closure. Some form of buoyancy will ensure that at least, even if it doesn't save them. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 So your an"idiot" if not wearing a life jacket? That attitude is less intelligent than not wearing a jacket. People should have the right to decide, they may decide incorrectly but that does not make them "idiots". there's a whole range of intelligence and there always will be, however, even people at the less detailed end of the scale have just as much right as the more detailed end of the scale. Link to post Share on other sites
Grinna 2 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Whats that quote? Something like ... "I'm not saying we should actively kill all the idiots, just take all the warning labels off everything and let the issue sort itself out." Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 So your an "idiot" if not wearing a life jacket? Note the quotation marks? Was simply using the term used by previous posters. Could have used "morons" or worse.... Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I guess your referring to dead people? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Whats that quote? Something like ... "I'm not saying we should actively kill all the idiots, just take all the warning labels off everything and let the issue sort itself out." amen to that Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 So your an"idiot" if not wearing a life jacket? That attitude is less intelligent than not wearing a jacket. People should have the right to decide, they may decide incorrectly but that does not make them "idiots". there's a whole range of intelligence and there always will be, however, even people at the less detailed end of the scale have just as much right as the more detailed end of the scale. Then we should allow the same discretion to those who are expected to risk their lives to save those at "the less detailed end of the scale" from drowning? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 We have to have dangerous situations for heroes to exist. These people know what they are getting into ( rescue services) and lifejackets will not prevent emergencies at all. Most of this mentality is media driven sh*t. That is if the media think people will get emotionally involved they will run stories on it and try and stir up some emotion. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 We have to have dangerous situations for heroes to exist. These people know what they are getting into ( rescue services) and lifejackets will not prevent emergencies at all. Most of this mentality is media driven sh*t. That is if the media think people will get emotionally involved they will run stories on it and try and stir up some emotion. Then....Coastguard really should be going to NZ On Air for funding!!!??? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Reality TV - CG to the Rescue Starts next month. Watch drunks get fished out of the Waitemata Hr, boats drifting aimlessly when the moorings break, drifting logs getting towed out of the shipping lane. Gotta be better than that Aussie Customs crap. Link to post Share on other sites
shorebreeze 0 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 So how do you deal with this situation? Adults take kids in the boat, not even their own and then advise those visiting passengers that life jackets are for wooses? So kids don't wear the lifejackets because they're left at home koz which cool kid wants to be regarded as a woos? Maybe regard the lifejackets like seat belts in a car. No guarantee of surviving a crash, but at least raises the chance of survival. Agree that taking twerps out of the gene pool is cool, but the kids haven't been proven as twerps until they grow up. Link to post Share on other sites
banaari 27 Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Don't know how often the situation you're describing actually happens. Point is that the number of drownings that WOULD actually have been prevented had the victims been wearing lifejackets, in situations where any proposed legislation might actually mandate them, is very very small. i.e. take out the guy who chose to jump off a wharf i.e. take out the fishermen swept off rocks by waves Sledgehammer to crack nut; and with no guarantee that the numpties in question will take anymore notice than they do of the more fundamental things which are more important; such as basic seamanship. (Unless you're willing to fund an enforcement regime - so far they can't even get compliance with the 5-knot rule which I'd argue is more important) Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Was reading Practical Sailer magazine and they had an article where they suggested trying to swim out from under an overturned dinghy with the lifejacked inflated (by mouth). According to them its impossible to do. Don't try this without lots of help about! I think its really important we realize our responsibilities as skippers. One area I think we do need jackets is if crew have had a drink. Link to post Share on other sites
shorebreeze 0 Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Unfortunately it happened to a friend's daughter when she was a youngster. Needless to say, that young lass having no previous knowledge of boats listened to the twerps and also needless to say was not allowed to go on their boat any more. Being an oldster, growing up with boats and water we were taught basic seamanship and weather observations from very young. Never used a lifejacket, never had one but then my father, ex naval chap, nearly drowned off Kauri Point in the Waitemata. Couldn't get his yacht upright, big heavy old thing and no lifejacket. He swum for shore, leaving his yachty mate holding onto the boat. Close thing for both of them. Not much in the way of Coastguard in those days. People going out in boats with barely any knowledge are certainly a serious factor. And maybe too much reliance of Coastguard coming to the rescue. Great work they do too. We were also taught, boats and drink don't mix. Ashore is the place for booze. But heck what would I know? I'm just an oldie. 5 knot rule? What's that? watch the speedsters in the Sandspit channel well inside the 5 knot area. New tactic, speed down the ski lane at full blast to get out to sea faster. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.