bluezeb 3 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Hi, I'm new to this game, and am learning to sail my little laser while I keep a lookout for a keeler - something a bit drier. Not in a mad rush, but here's the wishlist.. Must be a suitable first keeler. Handle offshore conditions well - I day dream of heading offshore to the South Seas in 3 years when I know what I'm doing - Hauraki Gulf, Bay of Islands, Mercury Islands before that. Must still be some fun to sail - I'll probably do a bit of social racing just for the crack of it. Has to be easy enough to singlehand. Budget 30K - 40K depending on what needs updating to get me through the first few years. GRP Hull - I love timber, but don't want the maintenance overhead. Decent cabin for liveaboard or longer cruising for 1 or 2 people.. Cavalier 32 seems to fit the budget and wishlist. I just had a squiz at Conquero in Westhaven today and the cabin space seemed good (though I don't have much basis for comparison). Any other models that might suit my budget/wishlist? Finally, any body know of any Cavalier 32s that are active in Auckland area that I might be able to get out on? I'll bring the beers/rum/smoothies etc Thanks in advance... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,227 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Welcome aboard. The Cav 32 is a good boat. I'm sure you'll get lots of replies, but on a fine weekend it might not be until Monday! What you are planning is certainly achievable. Be careful and thorough in your inspection of your preferred vessel, and make sure you get a survey! There are not a lot of 32 footers I'd go offshore in, but the cav 32 is one! Good luck with your search, and post your prospective vessels up here if you want some comments! Cheers Matt Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Panther 1,581 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I lived on a Cav 32 for 8 yrs and 30,000 miles, single and double handed. Conquero was Pete Smith's (the builder) own boat. I liked the tall rig but that will be harder to find. You could do a lot worse. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Unicorn 0 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Must be a suitable first keeler Yes, very suitable - although bigger and heavier than some other options, which means more physical input than some smaller or lighter alternatives. Handle offshore conditions well - I day dream of heading offshore to the South Seas in 3 years when I know what I'm doing - Hauraki Gulf, Bay of Islands, Mercury Islands before that. Excellent offshore, very stiff and seaworthy. They can handle at least 90 knots offshore, I know that. Must still be some fun to sail - I'll probably do a bit of social racing just for the crack of it. Good fun, especially upwind when it freshens up. A lot of the racing fun is a matter of finding similar yachts to sail against, regardless of how fast or slow they are. Has to be easy enough to singlehand. They are very powerful for their size and well balanced, which gives you a lot of flexibility. They can hold on to sail extremely well if the wind suddenly gets up. Even a #3 genoa in 40 knots is possible at a pinch. Budget 30K - 40K depending on what needs updating to get me through the first few years. Prices vary a lot, and do not always reflect underlying value. Spec levels did vary a bit depending on what options were selected. Sails, engines and other hardware will have different amounts of life remaining, and can be costly to replace. You need to research carefully, to determine final cost after any changes needed to make it into something that suits you. It is a buyers market with plenty to choose from. Your budget sounds realistic. GRP Hull - I love timber, but don't want the maintenance overhead. Just be careful to avoid anything with osmosis. Decent cabin for liveaboard or longer cruising for 1 or 2 people.. It is possible to spend a few weeks with 5 aboard. Should be very comfortable for 1 or 2. The high stability and fairly slow motion helps make life on board more comfortable. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bluezeb 3 Posted February 14, 2015 Author Share Posted February 14, 2015 Much appreciated folks. Very useful and also reassuring that the Cav 32 looks a good match for my wishlist. 8 years and 30000 miles says a whole lot Black Panther, and it certainly seems capable of handing bad conditions - hopefully I'll be too. Thanks for the specifics Unicorn. For the racing - I'm on Waiheke Island, so a small but friendly club - but once I get going, I could always head to town if I want a bigger field or year round racing. There are a few prospects on trademe that I'll look into further.. Red Baron in Waikawa seems pretty well set up and has the taller rig http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/auction-638278678.htm Sovereign in Tauranga looks tidy too http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/auction-813393832.htm Here's another which doesn't look as flash, but is a bit cheaper and rigging was repaced recently.. http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/auction-816099709.htm I'll come up with my idea shopping list and see how these compare for the big ticket items (hull condition, engine, sails, rigging and hardware), but reality is that I don't know what I don't know, and I'll be relying on specialists (surveyor or diesel mechanic) to do their job well. Anything likely to suit my wishlist other than Cav 32? - Makes it easier if not ! Cheers.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
erice 732 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 if your budget is 30-40k all up you may be better spending 15-20k on your first keeler and holding the rest for expenses this wouldn't be enough for a good cav32 but there are plenty of other 20-30' keelers that will do everything but offshore easier, less stressful + cheaper to get you soloing around the gulf right now http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/auction-847412384.htm http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/auction-846852982.htm or maybe this with a brand new engine http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/auction-847073581.htm Quote Link to post Share on other sites
erice 732 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 even better bang for buck in the learner stakes http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts/keeler/auction-847673548.htm 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin McCready 83 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 I have to agree with erice. Offshore is a quantum leap in terms of experience required, possible risk, Cat 1 standards for the boat (good liferaft alone adds big bucks, not to mention reliable self steering of more than one kind) and backups of backups for most of your systems. I also dreamt of long offshore voyages perhaps single-handed or with small crew. Having done a 32 day trip from Tahiti to Chile, I now would not do an extended voyage with fewer than four crew (for safe and not too tiring watch rotations). This probably means a bigger boat. Have fun. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,227 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Every person has their own level of acceptable risk that they are comfortable with. When shorthanded, or single handed, the proper management of fatigue is but one of the things you must manage. Personally I have done, and am likely to continue to do, single handed passages. Two handed is often harder - as most crews then try to keep a 24 hour watch, most of the time. This, of course, is not possible single handed. If 2 handed, fatigue in the first few days as you get used to the routine can be difficult. Its easier if both are capable of running the boat, so the other can get decent sleep. Three is pretty easy, again if all can run the boat. 4 capable sailors is really easy. IMO. Also though, IMO, the shorter the crew numbers, the better the electronics I want to help remain safe. That means $. Single handed, I want radar with guard zone and AIS transponder. Others are happy with nothing, but for me, that's not an acceptable risk. There are way more vessels out there now than 50yrs ago! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin McCready 83 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 To take a slightly different tack and pick up on Matt's point about the increased options in vessels these days, are there any boats of more modern design and open transom that would do the trick? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,227 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Yep, but I can't think of any with the OP's budget.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Panther 1,581 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Hard to go past the Cav 32 really, particularly for a first yacht. You just know that boat will look after you. If offshore is on the cards find one that has already done it, you'll get lots of extra gear for pennies on the dollar. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin McCready 83 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Thanks Matt. Leaving aside the budget for a moment, what boats would be on a good short list of modern designs that ?would give equivalent safety and perhaps forgiveness for short-handed crew. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,227 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Most small (ish) modern designs that were purpose designed to cross oceans are performace boats. So forgiveness for an inexperienced crew might be an issue. The Mini Transats come to mind - small, designed for singlehanding and crossing oceans. NOT a cruising boat! Class 40's are another. Maybe a Pogo 30?? All these may frighten a beginner!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,227 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 That being said, There are more production boats out there cruising than anything else. MOST make it home fine. You read of a few issues a year, (with both production and custom boats!) often poorly reported, with little or no background info as to the boat's history. Remember that there are currently over 10,000 boats out of their home countries, cruising, right now. (I can't remember where that figure comes from, so it could be wrong). A late model production boat may have a shorter life span than an older/heavier boat. The engineering has developed to the level where they know how many stress cycles the structure can take, and they design in the expected life. New production boats are stronger, IMO, than most believe, but they can/will deteriorate faster than their older cousins. Its a complex subject with much emotional comment. It's hard to get accurate info, if that even exists. Most read what they can, look around, speak to others, then take their choices!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Battleship 100 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Personally, if it were me unless I was going offshore in the next 2-3 years, I would be looking at something as an interim step more suited to coastal cruising and the odd race. Something like a y88 or Davidson 28 would be a lot more enjoyable to sail than a cav32 for 95% of weather conditions. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Knot Farr 1 Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 The Cav 32 ticks all your boxes. I had the same list of requirements and the same budget and after a long wait for the right one to come along I finally bought one and have never looked back, I love it. Easy to sail single handed, I do so regularly. Easy to reef the main as it is not too big and roller reefing headsail - easy. Also the rig is extremely well balanced, so much so I can leave the tiller swinging free and steer the boat with sail balance only, this means the autohelm is not working too hard. If you want to cruise with more than three or four people then the layout is not ideal, ie no separate cabins, however for a couple or small family they are great. A few points I found out along the way: Cav 32's are susceptible to osmosis, you need to buy one that has had a full bottom grind or if not allow the cost of getting it done, I think its around $25k, more than half your budget so it would have to be a very low purchase price to warrant this option. Some have had osmosis repairs or partial bottom jobs, these yachts may continue to need more repairs. I decided I wanted to buy one that had a new bottom and was lucky to find such a boat. If you can not get all your wish list ticked, then try to prioritise the items that require a high labour content to instal, for example, larger water tanks are not expensive to purchase, but would be a hassle and costly to fit, whereas a chart plotter you can just buy and fit yourself in 30 mins. So aim to get these difficult to fit items already in place then you can add the easy stuff later, even the life raft is easy to fit, so although costly to purchase, you don't need to pay someone to instal it. If possible get a good selection of sails, light wind and stronger wind options, I have 8 sails including 2 spinnakers a MPS, storm sails and different headsails, to my own surprise I use them all (haven't needed the storm sails yet). My yacht is in Marlborough, if you find yourself down this way, please call me I am happy to go out for a sail with you and show you the good and bad. Good luck, Phil. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
courageous 0 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 There is a very tidy Whiting 29 listed on TM. with late model 30hp Yanmar..Well worth a look. Great boats and very capable..one sailed to the UK.. plenty have been up to the pacific. Bigger than your Cav inside and no pox.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
erice 732 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 only whiting 29 turning up with search http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11415661 but old 15hp engine not same Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Southseasailor 0 Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 Howdy. I have a mint Cav 32 that is currently on the market. http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=905444511&ed=true Its possibly the best Cavalier in existence. This price is way more than your wishing to pay but if you could stretch your budget you would not be disappointed. Any way I'm happy to show you and take for a sail sometime. Kind Regards Dean Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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