Why cant we buy this Antifoul

[Battleship 100]

With all the new rules on anti fouling and not being allowed to scape hulls any longer, why can't we buy this antifoul paint for yachts.

Meant to last for 90 months and boicide free. Doesn't make sense to me.

 

http://www.international-marine.com/foulrelease/slime-release-coatings.aspx

[ScottiE 174]

why would they sell you sh*t that last 90months when the only have to sell you sh*t that lasts 9!

[Pumbaa 9]

Probably because it's for vessels that travel at over 10 knots. So for a yacht sitting in its berth it won't help and they've made the marketing decision for you.

[Black Panther 1,581]

I have been checking out coppercoat (thanks Fish) and the $$$$ side of it seems to stack up.

 

[Battleship 100]

Probably because it's for vessels that travel at over 10 knots. So for a yacht sitting in its berth it won't help and they've made the marketing decision for you.

 

Watch the video seems to work at 3 knots.

[Vorpal Blade 89]

So it would be ideal for multihulls then!!

[Farrari 4]

An article on Intersleek Pro here.  I assume it's something similar to 1100SR although in this case they are talking about prop speed alternatives.

 

http://www.boatingmag.com/how-to/high-performance-bottom-coatings

 

Seidel estimated that the whole process would cost $5,000 to protect the hull of a 30-foot boat. Seidel said that Interlux hasn’t pushed the Intersleek products for recreational use because of the price and the fact that it primarily should be applied by trained professionals.

 

 

I assume that's $5K USD?

[Guest waikiore2]

Coppercoat --good for those who like to scrub frequently, no good for me who only hauls every 24 months and expects an absolutely clean bottom between times. Will stick to Altex no. 5 till someone develops a polymer better than copper loaded ablative antifoul, that dispensed with bottom sanding for me years ago.

[Black Panther 1,581]

I'm using Altex 5 now, barely lasts 8 months. If you do try to wipe it as it is foul it all falls off.

[wheels 543]

BP, when you say the AF5 falls off, are you saying that the entire coat just falls away from the Primer? or that it is soft and easy to wash the surface away?
You are not supposed to wipe AF5 or any of the Ablatives. They are soft of course and the surface will wipe off. Any of the ablatives will dirty up when a Hull is sitting and where your Boat is moored, I would expect growth to be quite high. It is shallow, warm and lots of nutrients in the water, thus high growth. But your hull should clean itself while underway. Hempels "Olympic" ablative has a micro fibre material that controls the rate at which the paint ablates. Only a very thin section of the surface reacts with the water to become soft, so as the coating remains fairly hard underneath. I have so far had reasonably good results with the stuff, being up the river where it is also high growth.
http://www.hempelyacht.co.nz/products/category/antifoulings
There are other types in their range too, but I can't find it on the NZ site, so maybe the NZ dealer doesn't bring it in.

Do NOT expect Copper Coat to give you any cleaner Hull. It will dirty up also and likely worse. It requires the Hull to be cleaned regularly. it is great for racers and any hull that the owner can regularly clean. I would think you will find that a pain for a Boat your size and it would be too expensive to haul often.
Another coating to consider is a Self Polishing. Self Polishing Coatings react at the surface and continually self deplete. The Hull will remain really clean all year till it runs out. But a year is all it lasts and it is not cheap AF.

That Intersleek stuff is the one I was talking about in another recent post. Hempel created the stuff first and then International came up with their version. It is along the same lines as the Propspeed stuff, where it is a slippery surface nothing can adhere to. But neither companies sell it in consumer sized quantities and yes it has to be professionally applied. I can only guess at this, but I imagine that if you ever wanted to go to anything else after that stuff has been on the Hull, it may be a difficult task.
Ferrari, Intersleek is 1100SR

[Black Panther 1,581]

In that case the #5 is not performing as advertised. It gets very dirty very quickly and stays that way whether I sail it or not. It gets bad enough that I have no other option than to physically remove the growth (fist sized clumps of mussels anyone) and if I do that once the paint is stuffed. Jumping in the water to give it a clean doesn't bother me. And Fish says he is getting over 12 months between cleans.

I'm still investigating but it sounds good to me at the moment.

[wheels 543]

You are right, there is something wrong there BP. Slime and silt is what I was meaning would build up, but not mussels. How long has it been on? If only months, maybe you need to go back to the person that applied it and ask for a please explain.

[Black Panther 1,581]

Applied professionally in May this year.

[wheels 543]

Hmmm, yeah that should not happen. AF5 is a well proven AF and should be giving you far better protection than that in that short time. I would be asking the Applicator to investigate why it is not working. Don't roll over on this BP. It's a good well proven product and you should make some noise about it. The applicator needs to get to the bottom of why it s not working. If he can't answer, he needs to get the Rep involved. This is their Job as well. Not just selling coatings. They are technical reps and should be able to tell what has gone wrong. You need to get firm enough on this, that you expect the Boat to be hauled and recoated. Threaten them that if they don't, you will be making public noise and going for someone elses product and a different applicator.
The only issue right now is that it is so close to Christmas and the yard will be backlogged, but that is not your problem. At the least, you need someone to view the boat NOW even if it is in the water, so they know there is a problem. Otherwise it will be after Christmas and someone will say, oh it is because it is nearly a year.
In a nut shell, AF5, International and Hempel are coatings that are very similar in performance expectations. They should give you 12months protection at the least. Two years is within reach of them providing a decent coat has been applied and the boat used and a decent speed to clean, both of which you do. Three years is a stretch, and you expect growth, but not as bad as not having a coating at all. So you should be able to expect much much more from AF5 BP.
 

[Fish 0]

Hi BP,

If you had new antifoul applied in May this year and are getting mussels now, you have a technical / application issue. As Wheels says, I would raise that with the supplier.

 

We dried out yesterday. First time since 29th March 2014. Hull was good, did need a clean, but just a reasonable layer of normal slime and a small handful of barnacles. No grass, I was surprised. Almost thought I didn't need to dry out, until I saw the prop shaft, which had mussels all over it and the prop needed attention also.

 

I've got photos which I will put up when I get a moment.

[erice 732]

just under 1 year ago 

 

mine went back into the water with 3 coats of white interlux 2-pack, 1 coat of medium blue micron33 anti-foul, and 2 coats of cheap soft black ablative, (altex5?)

 

after 6 months of regular sailing the prop wash had pushed off the 2 black ablative coats from the rudder and around the prop. showing the blue micron33 underneath

 

the same 6 months of wavelet action while sitting on the mooring also took off the ablative around the waterline

 

another 5 months has seen the micron33 washed off too so we are now down to the white 2pack undercoat around the prop and waterline and varying shades of black, blue + white everywhere else

 

barnacles are just starting to form on the undercoat and prop, they knock off easily but presumably are taking the undercoat with them

 

have bought some harder, black sea hawk cukote for the next application

 

so next time will put the last of some micron ultra behind the prop, the remaining blue micron33 around waterline and prop, then cover that with a coat of black cukote

 

and finally 2 coats of cukote over everything

 

hope that protects the undercoat for 12 months

[Fish 0]

Photos of copper coat, first clean in 20 months. Last dried out end of March 2014.

Basically no grass, small handful of barnacles. 'normal' slime and not much else. Note the prop shaft did have mussels growing on it, and the prop needed attention also. Very pleased with the performance of copper coat. Boat had very little use of this period. 

 

Boat cleaned and photos taken 26th November 2015.

[wheels 543]

Erice, I don't expect you will damage the barrier coat. That would take some doing.
Are you using Trilux 33, or one of the Micron CSC or 66 or??
What is your thinking behind coating with AF5 over top? You do need to be careful mixing your drinks like that. They likely use very different additives and more importantly, very different Solvents. That can cause the coatings to not perform as they should. Not saying that is a definite, but certainly possible. Each Coating type relies on different technologies to control the way they erode and different solvents can cause the coating to not cure correctly or damage it completely.
If you take a gander at the product data and look for what solvents are used in which product, you may find something more compatible, but even then, I can't be sure the active ingredients wouldn't intereact. In a nutshell, there are two different copper types and at the least, two different Zinc types used in AF's. But then on top of that, some, like the Micron range, have another additive for controlling slime.
Personally, you would be better with more coats of the same type of AF. You can still alternate colours OK if you want.
Another thought, tell the technical guys of International what you are trying to achieve and ask them what coatings may be better suited if you want to mix and match like that.
My view is that you should try Micron 66 and apply as many as 5 coats around all those high turbulence areas. It has a controlled self polishing surface that smooths itself as it ablates. Controlled means it doesn't sluice off like the AF5 does.

[Chewing Gum 17]

We have been using Altex No 5 for a long time and before that Altex 10. The last application was 2 years ago just before we circumnavigated NZ. Since then the boat has had little use apart from one trip to North Cape in February and return to Westhaven. It has only been cleaned once in 24 months and that was a light rub by Scuba about 9 months ago, luckily not long before inspection by the BOI Harbour outfit. We have just hauled and reantifouled with Altex 5 and could possibly have got another year out of it except for the lower part of keel from pushing through mud to Warkworth. Even when we hauled it was pretty clean considering it hadn't budged from the marina for nigh on 6 months. It is an expensive business on a 40 footer if you don't antifoul it yourself. All up over $3400 including the haulout at Pier 21 and propspeed.

BP - the most critical things are a good sand, plenty of paint and don't let anyone near it with a waterblaster and being careful with cleaning using a soft brush. We also try to leave it at least a couple of days before refloating and paint at this time of the year.

When we hauled it was way cleaner than those photos of Coppercoat apart from the lower keel which had no paint on it !

Micron 66 sounds like a good product but you have to remove any soft antifoul before you could apply it.

[Battleship 100]

Funny how people have different idea about how much growth is acceptable, I would sleep at night if my boat was a dirty as the previous photos. I get annoyed about a small layer of slime.

The last few years I have been using a light grey wet and forget antifoul. Snigger if you like but it works really well and is only a quarter of the price of 66. I usually haul once every 6 months for a clean and do a re coat about every 18 months but am very fussy about keeping it clean so brush every couple of weeks in the summer.