Marina eWof requirements

[wheels 543]

I think everyone has answered Dtwo's question. I wasn't totally clear on some points in it, so I will answer my own answer just in case. If you are wanting to connect anything to the shore power, you need a eWOF. If you don't connect to shore power, you don't need an eWOF.

I have been harping on about this eWOF business since it's inception. I see a big issue with Insurance if they ever got nasty and we all know that they are fast becoming nasty.
Technically, under the rules, because the AC is earthed to the Boat and the DC system is grounded, then they are called a "bonded" system. This means that the DC MUST also be inspected. This is utterly ridiculous in my opinion. And I know of heaps of boats that would never pass because the DC system must be installed to survey requirements. For instance, This even means that all terminal connections have to be captive ring terminals. I bet very few of you have those. So technically, very few boats are EVER going to pass. Let alone the Underwater bonding plates that are mega expensive, because they re cintered bronze and I bet most racers won't want something like that.
       As already said above, some inspectors are turning a deaf ear and blind eye to this. My question that no one has ever been able to answer me is, if a Boat ever catches fire and it was proven to be a fault in the DC system, the Insurance company is going to knock on the door of Mr Inspector and ask why the wire that should have been inspected and passed as a ring terminal suddenly became a spade terminal or open ring terminal or no terminal at all and would this mean the Insurance company now has one of those nasty little things we call a Null and Void Policy???????

I really truly believe this electrical thing needs to be taken to a higher power and at the very least, the DC system should be removed from eWOF requirements. It is ridiculous. I can not see any need what so ever. So why do we have it?? Because the Regs were never written for NZ. They have been cut and pasted from Oz and that most likely came from something else anyway. Maybe the US. Does Colregs cover electrical??? We need as a collective voice to take this further. Because I am pretty sure that my above warning about an insurance company will one day ring true

[smithy09 50]

I think everyone has answered Dtwo's question. I wasn't totally clear on some points in it, so I will answer my own answer just in case. If you are wanting to connect anything to the shore power, you need a eWOF. If you don't connect to shore power, you don't need an eWOF.

 

I have been harping on about this eWOF business since it's inception. I see a big issue with Insurance if they ever got nasty and we all know that they are fast becoming nasty.

Technically, under the rules, because the AC is earthed to the Boat and the DC system is grounded, then they are called a "bonded" system. This means that the DC MUST also be inspected. This is utterly ridiculous in my opinion. And I know of heaps of boats that would never pass because the DC system must be installed to survey requirements. For instance, This even means that all terminal connections have to be captive ring terminals. I bet very few of you have those. So technically, very few boats are EVER going to pass. Let alone the Underwater bonding plates that are mega expensive, because they re cintered bronze and I bet most racers won't want something like that.

       As already said above, some inspectors are turning a deaf ear and blind eye to this. My question that no one has ever been able to answer me is, if a Boat ever catches fire and it was proven to be a fault in the DC system, the Insurance company is going to knock on the door of Mr Inspector and ask why the wire that should have been inspected and passed as a ring terminal suddenly became a spade terminal or open ring terminal or no terminal at all and would this mean the Insurance company now has one of those nasty little things we call a Null and Void Policy???????

 

I really truly believe this electrical thing needs to be taken to a higher power and at the very least, the DC system should be removed from eWOF requirements. It is ridiculous. I can not see any need what so ever. So why do we have it?? Because the Regs were never written for NZ. They have been cut and pasted from Oz and that most likely came from something else anyway. Maybe the US. Does Colregs cover electrical??? We need as a collective voice to take this further. Because I am pretty sure that my above warning about an insurance company will one day ring true

Hi Wheels. I don't think you are correct here. I have a copy of the standard and nowhere does it say that you require ring terminals or need to comply with an installation to survey standards. There is a big list of items that need to be ticked off, and the DC system does need to pass as well, but I have never seen anything like you are suggesting. What I understand inspectors are currently doing is turning a blind eye to many of the items that should be checked.. You are correct that the marinas are over reaching their authority and becoming very heavy handed, with no good reason, and no return in added safety for boats that simply have a battery charger and dehumidifier fitted. As long as these run through a safe lead with a suitable RCD/breaker fitted, there should be no problem. The standard concerned is AS/NZ 3004 Part 2. I might have to buy part 1 as well as that governs Marinas.. I wonder if Westhaven complies??   

[wheels 543]

Interesting smithy. Is there any chance there has been a revision?? Because it certainly used to. And as a result, when I rewired my own boat, I used ring terminals because of that.

[DrWatson 375]

So, at the end of the day, if you either have no electricity on your boat, or if you care completely self contained, you don't need this eWOF thing? 

 

That's my take on the whole thing. But as soon as you plug anything into the marina 240 volts supply on the finger, you need an eWOF?

 

So if your boat has zero electrical circuits, and I mean zero, you can't run a dehumidifier?

[Island Time 1,235]

correct. No ewof, no plugin,

[marinheiro 352]

We had an Electrical inspector at Sandspit last week checking leads and EWOFs for anyone who made the request.

I asked him 2 questions in relation to some of the contentious issues

1. Is the current standard retrospective, ie do our older boats have to be revised to meet the current requirements? Answer - the standard is not retrospective, only requirement (and this is the tricky one) the installation should be "safe"

2. Is there any basis for inspectors making an EWOF inspection to check the DC as well as the AC system? Answer  - no. The EWOF only covers prescribed electrical work (ie >50V) as defined by the electrical regulations.

 

It was interesting talking to him to hear he found some AC installation problems, even on brand name Australian boats. 

[Island Time 1,235]

yes, thats what I understand, but that is not what some inspectors are saying. And I cant see anything in the regs that say that the regs are NOT retrospective. Have I missed something?

[smithy09 50]

Interesting smithy. Is there any chance there has been a revision?? Because it certainly used to. And as a result, when I rewired my own boat, I used ring terminals because of that.

It says you can use rings, spades or terminals. No soldered joints, no bare wire ends. Pretty easy..

[marinheiro 352]

The overarching legislation for Electrical Installations are the Electrical Safety Regulations 2010 (with quite a few subsequent amendments) - found here for some bed time reading

http://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2010/0036/64.0/whole.html#DLM2763501

AS/NZS 3004.2 is referenced in relation to conectable installations (clauses 60,76-78).

My understanding from working with Standards over the years and discussing the subject with the inspector is that they are for new work  and if retrospectivity is required there must be a legislative requirement for retrospectivity, eg a some years ago the requirement was introduced that all high rise buildings in Wellington be upgraded to the latest versión of the earthquake code. The inspector highlighted that alot of the land based electrical installations do not comply with the latest versión of AS3000 because there is not that requirement. 

Those inspectors sticking their noses into DC systems are overstepping the mark, their "battery limit" for the inspection is to ensure there is a connection to the vessel ground (noting Steel and aluminium boats then introduce further complications) - nothing further on the DC side.  

[ScottiE 174]

Isn't there two issues here?

1. The Regs and whether they are fit for purpose. Having been involved in reviewing standards development myself this does not surprise me.

2. That an effectively private organisation is not prepared to allow you to use a service without an EWOF. That's their right. If you don't like it then don't go there surely is the only option? If noone goes there because of this issue then they might sit up and take notice.

[ScottiE 174]

Oh and within the next 12 months they won't let you in without a valid gas cert either i'm guessing! As is thier right, whether you like it or not.

[AJ Oliver 154]

I'm sure most of you know this, but in case not . . 

 

the risks of electrocution due to stray currents are MUCH greater in fresh water - Taupo, for example, or other of your beautiful lakes. 

 

http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2013/july/electric-shock-drowning-explained.asp

[DrWatson 375]

learn something new everyday...

[Clipper 343]

I get not being able to attach your vessels power system to the marina without a cert.

 

I dont understand why you cant have one device plugged in (dehumidifier, maybe battery charger) to a certified lead/ebox. Seems beyond rediculous.

[wheels 543]

 

We had an Electrical inspector at Sandspit last week checking leads and EWOFs for anyone who made the request.

I asked him 2 questions in relation to some of the contentious issues

1. Is the current standard retrospective, ie do our older boats have to be revised to meet the current requirements? Answer - the standard is not retrospective, only requirement (and this is the tricky one) the installation should be "safe"

2. Is there any basis for inspectors making an EWOF inspection to check the DC as well as the AC system? Answer  - no. The EWOF only covers prescribed electrical work (ie >50V) as defined by the electrical regulations.

 

Which brings up another concern. None of the inspectors seem to be able to agree either. I think it goes to show that these laws are not particularly easy or clear to understand in some areas.

   Maybe there has been some kind of revision. I would have thought that would be clearly stated though. We had this law imposed on the Marlborough Marinas waaaay back. We were the first in the Country as far as I remember. So it would be at the least 15yrs ago I guess, or possibly even longer. I need to dig out the regs that I had at the time. Maybe my mind has become confusseld which doesn't surprise me.

   Nice work smithy. A very nice electrical installation.

[mattm 98]

As far as I can tell, the current version is from 2014, with an amendment in July 2015. I started reading it again yesterday, but it put me to sleep in less than an hour. There are a fair number of hard to follow rules so far (up to page 39 of about 80).

For example: batteries must be installed in a manner they are open to free air. If this is impractical they must be in a sealed box and have mechanical ventilation, even if batteries are sealed type. Vent duct must lead straight to open air with bends no more than 45 deg. Minimum exhaust vent rate (qv) for forced ventilation is calculated as follows:

Qv=0.006 x number of Cells x charging current in amps. So a yacht with a 100 amp alternator, one 12v house and one 12v start battery =12 cells, so 7.2 litres/ second or 432 litres /minute. System must be designed so if fan fails, charger(s) are stopped.

Natural ventilation size of inlet and outlet (A) = 100 x Qv. so for the above example, 100 x 7.2 = 720cm2, or a 26.8 x 26.8 square duct or 30cm diameter round one....

Cable outlets shall be air tight glands. Fuses must be used within 200mm of batteries on every circuit except engine start. Fuses can't be in battery box. Fuses can be more than 200mm from battery terminal, but not more than 1.8m, only if cables are in sheathing conduit or cable trunking the entire way from battery terminal to circuit protector (don't forget the air tight gland though?).

 

The above is not word for word, although I'm looking at the standard as I write this, the examples are mine, and based on a Wright 10, as I ponder how to get ventilation out of under a saloon seat, into open air, with less than 45deg bends, and without compromising watertightness of a sailing boat.... Also, the batteries need to be vented during any charging, even solar, so need to run a vent fan during solar charging? Albeit a smaller one than for engine alternator, however no one will fit multiple different fans will they....Wouldnt be hard to go backwards there... Also considering the complexity of putting a cutout on all charging sources if the fan fails... sounds messy.

[marinheiro 352]

If you have a "connectable" installation, ie caravan, boat etc with a hard wired AC system then the regs are clear that the installation must have an EWOF prior to connecting

In relation to leads to temporary equipment, the applicable clause seems to be (by inference) clause 89, "Use of Hand held appliances in certain high risk situations", which states equipment must be doublé insulated and an RCD must be used.

With inspections, Wheels is correct that the inspectors cannot agree, so all you can do is choose your inspector carefully, ie ask around and before engaging an inspector ask where he sees the limit of the inspection.

The other challenge is the Marina Operators Assoc keep cooking up their own rules, eg they are saying leads for an EWOF installation must be tagged. This is incorrect, the EWOF covers the lead as well but most marinas have made this additional ruling, all in the name of CYA.

[smithy09 50]

We had an Electrical inspector at Sandspit last week checking leads and EWOFs for anyone who made the request.

I asked him 2 questions in relation to some of the contentious issues

1. Is the current standard retrospective, ie do our older boats have to be revised to meet the current requirements? Answer - the standard is not retrospective, only requirement (and this is the tricky one) the installation should be "safe"

2. Is there any basis for inspectors making an EWOF inspection to check the DC as well as the AC system? Answer  - no. The EWOF only covers prescribed electrical work (ie >50V) as defined by the electrical regulations.

 

It was interesting talking to him to hear he found some AC installation problems, even on brand name Australian boats. 

If this is the case then he is not following the standard which is quite clear as to the tests that should be completed. I have attached the testing side of things from the 2008 standard. The layout is not 100% correct as I couldn't be bothered editing the whole thing. From here it is clear that the EWof does indeed cover the DC circuits on the boat as well.. Also interesting is the scope of the standard which states:

 

This Part of AS/NZS 3004 specifies requirements for the design, construction and

installation of electrical systems in recreational boats that have a length of up to 50 m, and

are designed for use on inland waters or at sea. It is not intended to apply to small boats

equipped with a battery supplying circuits for engine starting and navigation lighting only

that are recharged from an inboard or outboard engine driven alternator.

 

This would seem to indicate that the standard is indeed aimed at boats with a hard wired AC system built in, and not boats that have an extension cord running a battery charger and dehumidifier...

 

It seems that the Marina association have taken it upon themselves, maybe through pressure from worksafe, to impose this standard on us. What's more, it appears that the electrical inspectors are either not familiar with the standard, or simply turn a blind eye to it all. If this is the case, what do they want? Are they going to ignore the external earth bonding requirements?

 

What a can of worms...

Yacht electrical installation test.pdf

Scope of NZS 3004.pdf

[smithy09 50]

As I am now days from wiring my boat thus -  all 12V powered off 2 x 100wt panels and 2 x 200ahr LIFePO batteries in a sealed battery box designed to stay dry even if I have a couple of feet of water inside or are upside down. The whole electrical system is designed and being installed to continue to function right up to, and possibly a bit after, the point I'll be saying 'All hope is lost, it's into the raft time'.

 

I was thinking of fitting a 1000W inverter to get 240V for charging 18V power tool batteries and/or I will have a 1kva inverter genny but zero ability to connect shore power into the hard wired boat system. If I need shore power it will have to be a lead connected direct to whatever needs it.

 

Please tell me this crap doesn't apply to me.

It applies to you. You are plugging into shorepower, therefore according to the Marinas you need an eWof.

[Adrianp 120]

I was thinking of fitting a 1000W inverter to get 240V for charging 18V power tool batteries 

 

One of the reason I brought Ryobi 18v tools (and I know KMM has some too) is they make a car charger that runs of 12v.

 

https://www.bunnings.co.nz/ryobi-one-dual-chemistry-car-battery-charger-14-4-18v_p00309751