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ahhh NZ, what a breath of fresh air !!  With so much of the rest of the world being dictated too by aggressive , power obsessed, stupid old men.... So called leaders whose main interest is s

Well, while that may well be (appears to be) what he means, society has previously decided those under 18 are not sufficiently mature to make these decisions, the mentally deficient are not up to it,

I don't think that's what KM is saying at all.  KM is saying (maybe I'm wrong) that there is is some inherent unfairness when quite a large minority of the population are not able to vote - the m

On 25/10/2020 at 1:18 PM, Sabre said:

I'm trying to follow your logic here KM I really am.

Maybe as they were nothing more than passing comments of little consequence I'd think you'll be trying for a very long time.

Haven't we discussed how not everything is an attack or slight on your beloved politicians so you don't need to be so defensive nor jump at your self created shadows. Do we need to do it again?

 

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On 26/10/2020 at 2:35 PM, Sabre said:

Silly me what was I thinking.

Apparently IG, the antagonist formerly known as KM, also thinks the voice of the non-voters should somehow be taken into account...p

Yes I sure do. When I vote I do so taking into account what is best for NZ which does include those that can't vote like kids both mine and yours, the homeless, the infirm, the not to right in the heads, the elderly who are struggling, all those that for many assorted reasons don't or can't vote. To do otherwise would make me a selfish arsehole only in it for myself.

But hey, not everyone is like me in wanting the best for all NZers as this thread clearly shows. I find that sad, very sad.

 

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17 hours ago, DrWatson said:

I don't think that's what KM is saying at all. 

KM is saying (maybe I'm wrong)

Sadly wrong sorry Doc, as mentioned it was only passing comments barely more than thinking out loud.

 

17 hours ago, DrWatson said:

The only voices who "don't count" are essentially the 15% of registered voters who simply opted out (these are the non-voters and they're distinctly different from the can't voters). But even then we must be careful that we don't assume the reason they didn't vote is simply that they couldn't be arsed. Many other reasons are possible (sick, car broke down and couldn't get to the polling station, had to take a kid to hospital etc.)

Until they, politicians, decided to hide the truth that there is a growing number of NZers dissatisfied with the system and think it has lost it's 'fit for purpose', the post election survey asked those that could but didn't vote why they didn't. The last time they put the numbers out, around 2012 I think it was, they showed over 450,000 did not vote as they see the system as now wrong. That 450K was up on the previous survey which was up on the one before which was up on the previous. It was the fastest growing political 'group' in the few elections leading up to the options removal. That group is commonly included in 'the missing millions'.

And BULLSHIT to the 'if you don't vote you have no say' line. That is old school stuff now used by pollies to make sure people do vote and in doing so legitimise the pollies themselves. Out forefathers and foremothers went to war and died so we could have the freedom to make life choices which includes political ones. Not voting as you see the system is flawed is a choice and one most do not make lightly. If the pollies weren't scared and did want open and honest votes then they would include a 'I think they are all muppets' option on the voting paper. I find those who push the 'no vote no say' line as ideal people to target when you have a spare bridge to sell as they are obviously susceptible to even very basic marketing.

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Think we need to have compulsory registration(it is I think?) and compulsory to vote or face a fine. Even if you just spoil the voting card you have been recorded as a voter. Those incasterated (prison 12 months or more )no right to vote. 

What should the voting age be set at?? 16 leave school drive a car leave home get married or participate in homosexuality or normal sex.

18 can vote drink alcohol smoke buy lotto go to war

20 can go to casino

anything I missed??

What age limit to vote would I put it at. 20 for everything above.Hmm maybe not sex . 

 

 

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I thought this article was interesting  . . 

there are quite a few people out there who do not do politics . .  

There are prolly some in Aotearoa too 

(But the Drumph is likely right - if they all voted US Republicans would never win any election) 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/26/us/election-nonvoters.html?searchResultPosition=11

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2 hours ago, KM... said:

Yes I sure do. When I vote I do so taking into account what is best for NZ which does include those that can't vote like kids both mine and yours, the homeless, the infirm, the not to right in the heads, the elderly who are struggling, all those that for many assorted reasons don't or can't vote. To do otherwise would make me a selfish arsehole only in it for myself.

 

Well fark me! That makes you sound almost human.

It looks like we share exactly the same line of thinking in that regard although it only works if you actually vote.

If I was voting just for my own best interests I would certainly have ticked completely different boxes.

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On 28/10/2020 at 5:15 PM, Sabre said:

Well fark me! That makes you sound almost human.

It looks like we share exactly the same line of thinking in that regard although it only works if you actually vote.

If I was voting just for my own best interests I would certainly have ticked completely different boxes.

Your post is another excellent example of why I could never go much leftish. Also a good post to demonstrate why at times it's wiser to employ a marketing company than try and do it yourself.

 

On 28/10/2020 at 4:22 PM, harrytom said:

Think we need to have compulsory registration(it is I think?) and compulsory to vote or face a fine. Even if you just spoil the voting card you have been recorded as a voter.

What would that achieve?

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3 hours ago, KM... said:

Your post is another excellent example of why I could never go much leftish. Also a good post to demonstrate why at times it's wiser to employ a marketing company than try and do it yourself.

 

What would that achieve?

Probably not a lot,stops media/govt going on about low voter turn out.By spoiling ones vote papers is a protest against the establishment??Maybe needs to be done online but how secure would that be??Last census we had I filled in the household numbers online with all sorts of crazy answers,but census done so cannot prosecuted for avoiding but does not say answers must be truthful.

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