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A dream...


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Hi guys. Just stumbled upon this forum and am impressed with the wealth of knowledge flowing through these virtual pages!

 

Firstly, let me introduce myself... Although I've spent much of my life around the ocean, I've only recently been captured by sailing, or rather the cruising side of it anyway! I've been lucky enough to spend a few weeks on a friend's yacht around Samoa and just recently around Indonesia. Heading back to Bali in a week or so to jump on board for another month of cruising through Java and Sumatra. I love the challenge and excitement of it all, and thoroughly enjoyed the long nights at the helm on some of the passages we've done. I've also spent a lot of time working on boats at sea around the south of New Zealand and the Subantarctic, so I know some of the things the ocean is capable of, and have a tremendous respect for it!

 

Anyway, for the last while I've been giving serious consideration to getting my own boat... with a long-term dream of offshore cruising at some stage in the future. The very vague plan is to get myself a boat asap and live on it at a mooring in Otago Harbour (I'm Dunedin-based). Then, spend a year or so learning to sail this boat, and/or smaller classes of yacht if possible too. I'd then like to be able to do some coastal cruising around the lower South Island/Stewart Island, possibly solo. Finally, a few years from now I'd like to embark on bigger journeys, to the Pacific Islands and beyond. I know these are all big and ambitious plans, but you've got to start somewhere, right?

 

So, a few specific questions...

 

1. Am I being overly ambitious? Should I start smaller and learn properly in small boats? I understand much about offshore crusing from spending time on my friend's 39fter, but definitely couldn't jump aboard and sail any boat off into the sunset! The main appeal of getting a larger boat (thinking 26-30ft) sooner, is to have a (small) home, and get off the grid as much as possible, in terms of electricity etc. I've been paying rent for more than ten years, and a liveaboard boat has huge appeal and is much more achievable than buying a house on a single income... well a modest boat anyway!

 

2. Boats. I've spent a fair bit of time on this forum and other such places, getting excited about all sorts of boats, and then realising most of them are out of reach financially! I have about 30K to play with, but would rather get a cheaper boat and have some aside for repairs, making it a liveaboard, and future preparation for offshore journeys. The two major criteria are a) a boat I can live on, and B) a boat that is capable (or can be made capable) of offshore sailing... and probably selling for around 20K or less. Does anyone have any suggestions? I'm really liking the look of a Raven 26... seem like capable little boats, and I reckon I could (just) live in one by myself! What about any others up around the 30ft mark? Chico 30's look nice, but probably out of my budget. What should I be looking for if I'm looking for a boat that has offshore potential?

 

3. Transport. Obviously Dunedin isn't the hub of sailing in NZ, and it's probably unlikely that I'll find the boat I want there. As I'm definitely not capable of sailing a yacht from points further north myself, what are the options for getting it to Dunedin? Enlist some keen and experienced sailors to help me sail south? Chuck it on a truck? Guess that would cost 2-3K.

 

Anyway, I'll leave it there for now. I look forward to hearing any suggestions you all might have, and please don't hesitate to tell me if my head is in the clouds with all this! Also, apologies in advance if I'm a little slow responding to posts... in Borneo now, and won't have much internet time once I'm back on my friend's yacht!

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Moving aboard will certainly up the savings rate. Good first step.

 

I was going to say Chico 30, or a Cav 32, neither will get you into trouble. There was a Chico up here I heard went for around 18k (little rot under the stanchions - no big deal). But anything ocean capable in that price range is going to need money spent on it, but if it is a 2-3 year plan you can do that as you live on it.

 

The only other strong suggestion would be do a major offshore passage (if you haven't already) with someone experienced.

 

Otherwise buy a boat, move on to it, start getting ready and buy some Jimmy Buffet cd's.

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Years ago i spent alot of time sailing the Otago Penn and down to Stewart Island on a H28.

 

You'll get a very good one for 30K, they are easy and forgiving to sail, blimmin seaworthy and big enough to live aboard. Certainly you wont break any speed records in them, but if your after a good learner cruising keeler that would suit the conditions down there, go take a look at the few. Several have been around the world i believe.

 

If you use google you should find a good NZ based class website

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Thanks guys... good to hear that my headsail isn't in the clouds! Those H28's look great... really roomy inside and good to hear they can handle a bit of the rough stuff! There's a couple on trademe in Dunedin too, but a bit out of my price range... will go and check them out if they're still around in mid-October when I'm home (hopefully all that snow has cleared off by then!). Squid, haven't done anything of great length... only a few overnighters. If I don't spend all my money on this boat thing, I might try to sail across the Indian Ocean with my friend next year. Doing a couple of decent passages is definitely in my thinking before I attempt anything much myself.

 

A couple more questions...

GRP vs Wood? GRP appeals for lower maintenance, but should I be completely scared off by wooden boats?

 

Does anyone know about mooring/berthing in Otago Harbour? Looks like the Otago Yacht Club has piled moorings... will check them out when I get home. Any idea of costs of these and whether they're happy with liveaboards? What are the logistics of getting moorings in other bays around the harbour? Sorry, real newbie questions!

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I just checked Trademe and the H28 'Tiersel' is the H28 i cruised on down there.

 

My perfectionist uncle built her (along with Miller and Tonage i think) in about 1970, and while he owned her, she was immaculate with a capital I

 

Hes currently living in Port Chalmers, and i could put you in touch if you're interested in her.

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All the yachts sofar suggested are good including the Raven, remember that the asking price is just that, it is what the seller may wish for and often a bit more than that, it gives him wriggle room, I wold expect in many cases asking price less %20 would be average. That being said it is a buyers market. It can be fatal to fall in love with a particular boat (yeah don't ask) be prepared to walk away. Get help from other experienced yachties to check out any prospective purchase, there are some good surveyors out there but you generally only find out how good / bad they were after the fact.

Go for the dream, it is very feasible, you don't need all the bling or even a fraction of it, work on the KISS principle the simpler things are the easier they are to fix.

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What ever boat you buy, length matters when living aboard, IMHO.

Simply that bit more storage, and with length, beam increases some times! The worst often been when it has been raining for a week and its cold and your feeing miserable. All this and you are still on a mooring. A few inches here and there to be comfortable become vitall important. However tomorrow the sun should shine :thumbup:

 

For the same price, go for the longer boat, other things being equal.

 

The ocean is a big place, and in a storm, length matters.

 

On small boats you get knocked around by the waves.

 

On big boats you get knocked around by the size of the gear.

 

A good way is to sail on as many different types of boats as you can until you find what suits you best before committing funds. Seeing different setups, sail handling, deck equipment etc will give you more experience.

 

Then off you go . . . So good luck :wave:

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A good way is to sail on as many different types of boats as you can until you find what suits you best before committing funds.

I agree because there are some big boats that feel very small inside and some small boats that feel very big, all due to the design.

Two things we enjoy about our boat, firstly the Pilot house splitting the fore and after quarters. With an aft cabin, then the Pilot house, then the Galleyand Soloon area, if you have guests onboard, there is a speration that allows them to have their space and us ours. If in wet weather, the cabin fever does not get quite so bad because if anyone wants space to themsevles, they have a quite place to go.

Second was something created later foir us. When I biult the aft stearing area, I discovered that being up higher by just another 3 or 4 ft, made such a huge difference to how you view a large sea. In the Pilot house, it can feel like the Big seas around you are daunting. Going up those few feet to steer, suddenly makes the boat seem so much bigger and the sea not so big. Just a head thing and possibly not a factor for someone else, but it has always made me think that a design with the centre cocp[it up high wopuld make a very safe position. I have heard negative things like they can be dangerouse if swamped, but hell, if seas are that flamin big that a centre cockpit can be swamped, I doubt you are going to be outside stearing anyway. More than likely closed in below strapped to a berth awaiting the storm to pass over you. Just my Opinion anyway.

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Everything on a boat is a compromise, and people will view them differently, that's why we all have different boats, For example, the counter to Wheels' above argument is that the higher the cockpit the more violent the motion in a seaway, but he likes his. Just another thread in life's rich tapestry.

Unfortunately you, like most of us, are constricted by budget, but I would still say buy what you can afford and go for it.

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Yacht around 32 feet they are heaps faster than the h28, Hull speed on the h28 is about 5 knots whereas a decent 32 footer will give you around 7 knots which is about 40% faster. If you can find a good ferro cement thats professionally built they are usually great value for money. A bit of size actually makes them easier to move about on, carry a dinghy and heaps more storage. Ferro's are great for a liveaboard, very little maintenance is required on the hull. This is in Aus and a bit outside your range but what a great liveaboard, cruiser......http://www.boatsales.com.au/boats-for-s ... ?R=9158702

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Thanks for the suggestions and support everyone. I've been doing a lit more reading, and it does seem feasible. Although I'd like a bigger boat, smaller boats are generally cheaper and cost less to maintain/fit. I'm still liking the look of H28's, so if anyone hears of a goodish one going for around 20-25K, let me know! Once I'm back in NZ I'll be getting on as many boats as possible and getting a good feel for what I'm after.

 

Cheers,

Chris

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Although I'd like a bigger boat, smaller boats are generally cheaper and cost less to maintain/fit. I'm still liking the look of H28's,

 

Keep in mind that a H28 has a lot under the water, you are going to use a lot of anti fouling compared to a davidson 28 or nova

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Good point. I've been looking at Ravens and Nova 28's again too... and they're selling substantially cheaper than the H28's. Why is this exactly? Wooden hulls vs GRP? Or is the overall design of H28's more suitable for coastal/offshore cruising... heavier ballast etc. I'm sure H28's make better offshore boats, but could I save a bunch and still sail around southern NZ in a Nova or Raven?

 

An option could be to start off with one of these and then move onto something around 32ft down the track. Thoughts? My 30K budget is firm, and I think I could struggle to get an H28 + liveaboard fitout (solar and wind etc) for this. With one of these other boats, I could do all that with 20K. GRP has real appeal from a 'not-likely-to-rot' point of view however.

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Most H28's on the market are GRP, the early ones were wooden and ketch rigged. Compass yachts version which is most of what is on the market are Glass. also the compass ones are longer than 28feet (29foot10inches I think.) They hold their price because they are a popular design and are more forgiving than some of the later (faster? ) designs. Re anti fouling costs there probably isn't more than a litre difference in the amount required. Remember most yachts below 40 feet used for cruising end up with an average speed of 4 and 1/2 knots, especially if you head up to the tropics where lack of wind is of more concern than too much wind.

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All this talk about boat types etc is enormously interesting. I, myself, am a fan of Chico 30s (having owned one and cruised her in the Pacific).

 

But the guts of this question is the issue of Living aboard.

 

And, to answer that question honestly one has to take into account several issues beyond boat designs, or types, styles.

 

The first of these is space (internal volume). All sorts of boats may be fine, weatherly, seakindly boats but if they are percieved as being claustrophobic, it's all off.

 

Secondly, and equally importantly, is motion. It takes some time, and love, and understanding, and forgiveness, to eliminate the issues surrounding a lively and chundiferrous hull shape. Indeed, the chances of forgiveness are remote as regards some of the boats mentioned earlier in this thread.

 

My wife and I (we spend half the year on the boat) have managed to survive mutual self destruction solely because we have gradually raised the displacement of our various boats as we aged..

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