wheels 543 Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 What is the AirX doing, or not doing? So does the SolarWind have inputs for both WindGen and Solar? The only possible problem I see, is that the AirX is 3 phase. I have no idea what the SilentWind is and I don't know what kind of Voltage the two makes deliver in AC. Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,230 Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Yep, the silentwind has input for the gen and the solar - hence they call it the hybrid controller. Not sure if it is single phase or 3 phase - I'll find out. Also not sure how the braking system works on an AirX.... Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 And sadly there is very little schematic detail available on the net for the AirX to be able to see how they made it all work. IT, I would expect the SilentWind to be single phase and thus have two wires going to the controller. I would imagine having to run three wires for 3 phase would be a turn off for potential buyers. Link to post Share on other sites
Fusion 0 Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 As with IB I enjoy the noise the Air-X puts out and when sailing it pumps in good amps. Seeing the six blade aftermarket kits available on ebay got me thinking. We change sails to suit the wind, why not change blades. I have spent 4 days at sea in wind over 40kts the Air-X was in self shutdown mode most of the time so FA out put. Another friend had the mk1 Air-X that threw a blade tip so they trimmed them all to match and it only worked in high wind. Has anyone tried the longer or six blade option for the Air-X? Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,230 Posted February 5, 2014 Share Posted February 5, 2014 Fusion, change the blades to silent wind ones. That is what we have, you won't regret it! Have a look on my Neptune's Gear advert on here... Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Island Time has the "aftermarket" blades if I understand correctly. I don't believe these blades are any longer, but they are slightly boarder across the blade and they are slightly thicker allowing a little more "wing" profile. I am not aware of an Off the Shelf 6 Blade alternative. Wind genny design is complex. It is why there has been so much improvement in recent years. There are some fundamental rules of thumb. A blade makes noise period. The amount of noise is part and parcel to the following. Shape, (which includes foil shape and blade tip shape)= causing turbulence. Angle of attack= Turbulence. Rigidity of Blade= Flutter. Speed it is traveling through the air at (revolutions and distance from centre= Turbulence. The Surface area= width and length of blade. So if you consider all that, Basically its the more blades, the more noise. The faster you spin them, the more noise. The bigger the size, the more noise. But there have been big gains in efficiencies in latest blade technology and those efficiencies all add up to being able to do more with less noise. The next part of the equation is the Generator design itself. A Manufacturer wants to get the best possible power they can (obviously) but they have to firstly choose what they would expect to be the greatest average Airspeed. Then they design a power curve based on the chosen airspeed. Then they design the blades to spin the thing at that speed with the best possible power they can develop from the wind. Normally said, the more Blades you have, the slower the wind speed it has been designed for. The reason is that blades spinning really fast starts to cause turbulence for the next blade in the path. In other words, the trailing edge of the leading blade in the Rotation path causes eddies and the leading edge of the next blade then runs into those eddies. So you keep the blade spacing further apart. Normally more blades--equals more surface area--equals more torque--equals more power able to be delivered. But it also equals more noise. Blades today are so much more efficient than those older multi blade units, but they get their power from speed through the air, so you will note with a three blade unit, the blades spin so fast they become invisible. Link to post Share on other sites
Fusion 0 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I have seen the Blue blades but they would need to be pretty good for $300 + USD thats half the price of a Air-X Here are the options I have seen. Mostly for lower wind setups. 6 long/wide blades with hub for $110 USD Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Wow, the 6 blade unit look impressive. That must develop awesome power. I would love to know how noisy it is. Interestingly, the "Original" blade looks different to mine at the Tip. The tips on mine are sharper and slightly eccentric in arc, not ending abruptly like shown. I wonder how the abrupt finish sounds noise wise. 28" for the big one, man that's a big blade, especially on a Boat. Link to post Share on other sites
Fusion 0 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 just found this: "The first thing we had to do was to extend the tail since the 62" rotor was trying to fly downwind. The 403/AirX 17mm shaft is the same as the Eagles shaft so everything bolted up just fine although a few shaft spacers are required to get the blades away from the PMA housing. The results were amazing! The blades would simply not stop turning! Even when there was no perceivable wind in the air the blades turned at about 100 rpm. Even in seemingly dead calm wind conditions its was puzzling to ponder why the blades kept spinning. We can deduct that it was partially due to the superb bearings Southwest Wind Power uses on their turbines in combination with our big blades." "Impression The 403/AirX was transmuted into a low wind / high amperage powerhouse in charging conditions that drew high amp loads. Shorting out the output wires will not stop the big blades from turning in wind conditions that exceed 14+ MPH. They will just keep turning and making power (Careful! The wires get hot!) " Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,230 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Yep those blades are huge. The air x is a discontinued model. The air breeze is the current model. It retails for about $1250 USD. IMO $350 USD is not an enormous amount for well engineered, quiet and efficient blades and nowhere near 1/2 the price. The silent wind blue ones are even visibly better than the standard blades, being finished to a mirror type standard. I think mine were well worth the extra money. That's why I sell them on my site, but of course everyone must make their own decision Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,230 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I'd also be very wary of the big blades in a blow - he states that the brake system cannot stop the blades - so you can't even tie them safely. The air xand air breeze both have a rreputation for burning out circuit boards if the system overheats - as it will if you can't stop it. That being said, it would be good to have the high charging ability at low windspeed! Link to post Share on other sites
Fusion 0 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 The Sunforce 44446 or replacement marine version of the Air-X is US $595.42 Approximately NZD729.15 My Air-X was $950.00 AUD years ago they were $3500.00 NZD at the time. Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I'd also be very wary of the big blades in a blow - he states that the brake system cannot stop the blades - so you can't even tie them safely. The air xand air breeze both have a rreputation for burning out circuit boards if the system overheats - as it will if you can't stop it. I agree, that is a real concern. Link to post Share on other sites
Fusion 0 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 The Air-X is not the most robust. The burnout and fly apart. My supplier makes this comment: "Over the past 3 years there have been around 10 legitimate warranty claims for Rutland and no warranty claims for Ampair. Over that same period of time I have performed more than 150 warranties on Air - that's one each week. That's around 12.5% of turbines sold have come back for warranty service." Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,230 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Also, the sunforce is a separate company, nothing to do with airx or air breeze. Southwest wind power made the air range. They suddenly disappeared in Feb 2013. Their business was sold (the air part) to primus wind power. Their website is currently down. Not sure why. Looks like I was wrong, and the airx IS still available, one normally competitive site listing it at 1100 euros. There are cheap gens available, as low as $300 nzd. Like most things, you generally get what you pay for. Proper engineering, including wind tunnel design and test is not cheap. Hence the knockoffs. I like SilentWind, as you have probably noticed! High output, low noise, sound engineering. Everyone must decide for themselves.... Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Sunforce sounds like a Chinese machine. Is it?? I would be very wary of Chinese. My AirX has given me no problems. It does all it is supposed to and expected of it. The Bearings were replaced sometime back. You need to keep an eye on the bearings, but the same applies to all Wind gennies. You can't expect them to run endlessly with no maintenance. The Bearings are what keep the Armature in perfect position and if the bearings collapse, the armature can hit the Windings and do damage. The bigger the daimeter of the Blades, the more leverage is going to be placed on shaft and Bearings, so such a case may need more regular checking. I have gone through one set of blades, but that was after a blow of 86kts. I am not sure at what wind speed the Blades went, but they bent back enough to hit the mounting pole and shattered. Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,230 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Sunforce, made in Taiwan.... But that's not necessarily a bad thing. Link to post Share on other sites
Fusion 0 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Sunforce, made in Taiwan....But that's not necessarily a bad thing. Part of Coleman! the camping lights and stuff company. Mostly badging OEM stuff. Coleman Solar and Coleman Wind all look like they are not manufactured by them. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Sunforce sounds like a Chinese machine. Is it?? I would be very wary of Chinese. Yep!! There's a plethora of Chinese knock offs, they look like exact copies! ("exact" used tongue in cheek!). An example, http://www.sunpowerplus.co.nz/Great%20Watt%20Wind%20Turbines.html. The vendors only guarantee them for 1 year because the inbuilt regulator burns out (presumably at 13 months!). $599 DISPOSABLE turbine!!?? Be careful of the "marine" versions. The marine refers to the COATING on the housing and nothing to do with use on the ocean! Very cleaver the Chinese! Unfortunately, their reputation precedes them! For my money, its a Silentwind..when Matt gets the latest hybrid and price?? Link to post Share on other sites
Tim C 23 Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Okay I'll admit to having one of these chinese wind turbines! But it is not all bad! I bought it direct from China, for a similar price to what is being offered here in NZ. The agent has communicated well, and continues to keep in touch. Delivery was in six days. It has gone well for the last two years. It gets taken off for important races, but otherwise is working. It is mounted on elliptical carbon tubes. It has been as quiet as any wind generator I've seen, and certainly quieter than the standard AirX. At peak it manages 15A, but typically under 8. It shuts down in about 30 knots of apparent and idles. Perhaps that is a bit low, but I guess protects itself well. The paint is failing on the unit, but I'll repaint it this winter. The controller is sophisticated and works well. The cut off voltage is too low (11V) and can't be modified. I'm talking to the factory about this. But it does have good readouts of voltage and amps going in and out. For less than half the price of other units at the time I've been more than happy. I'd rather spend the change on sail cloth.... Wind is certainly only a part of the charging solution. My 110W solar panel does the bulk of the work. Link to post Share on other sites
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