Gybing strategy with runners and backstay, and masthead kite

[Ziggy Bentley 0]

Sailing on a Ross 830 two-handed with fractional runners, and a masthead backstay, which doesn't clear the top corner of the square-top main when it gybes. Swept back speaders only to just below fractional halyard. What is the best strategy to manage the gybe with two people (or even fully crewed) when the wind picks up and mast support is needed throughout the gybe. Should we ignore runners grind on some vang, and then just try to get backstay on ASAP after gybe, keeping in mind there's only one person in the cockpit for the majority of time before gybe as kite pole needs to be dealt with. Or do the Ross 830 senders of the forum have a different strategy. Cheers 🙂

[B00B00 317]

Fixed topmast backstay and a squaretop main? That is a recipe for an expensive day on the water. 

You need masthead runners if you plan to use masthead spinnakers and a squaretop main.

You could reef the main so it clears the backstay?

 

[mattm 106]

My (very modified) 830 has runners and split top mast on the same line into the cockpit - so they’re pulled on together. The clutch is about where the driver sits, so I can release, or someone sitting forward of the traveller can. They’re winched on when needed using the windward primary - I don’t have self trackers, and use primary winches on the coamings for jib trim. I can manage them while driving short handed. Let off and pull on to hand tight, then a bit of a winch if required once things are under control. 
The way mines setup, I don’t have to worry about the mast falling down without them. I’ve raced a bit lately without having them more than hand tight to keep them out of the way. 
 

Maybe time for a change to the rig setup?

 

Can send pics of mine if you like?

[Ziggy Bentley 0]

8 hours ago, B00B00 said:

Fixed topmast backstay and a squaretop main? That is a recipe for an expensive day on the water. 

You need masthead runners if you plan to use masthead spinnakers and a squaretop main.

You could reef the main so it clears the backstay?

 

Sorry my bad it does have a backstay flicker and synthetic backstay, so it does clear the squaretop if entirely eased, but its not particularly easy to let off fully.  I agree it seems like a weird setup that has lots of potential to go wrong, we are quite new to the boat and were just wondering if there was a specific reason a masthead runner system wasn't set up...

I think the plan for the near future is to splice a system together so that both fractional and masthead runners can be pulled on a single line, each with some sort of tuning system, and to get rid of the backstay entirely. I assume it would just complicate things once a decent runner system has been set up.

And yes once reefed down theres no problem and becomes easy to manage. Thanks

[Ziggy Bentley 0]

1 hour ago, mattm said:

My (very modified) 830 has runners and split top mast on the same line into the cockpit - so they’re pulled on together. The clutch is about where the driver sits, so I can release, or someone sitting forward of the traveller can. They’re winched on when needed using the windward primary - I don’t have self trackers, and use primary winches on the coamings for jib trim. I can manage them while driving short handed. Let off and pull on to hand tight, then a bit of a winch if required once things are under control. 
The way mines setup, I don’t have to worry about the mast falling down without them. I’ve raced a bit lately without having them more than hand tight to keep them out of the way. 
 

Maybe time for a change to the rig setup?

 

Can send pics of mine if you like?

That seems like a really good system and is what we are thinking of doing, but don't quite have the plan together yet. Same with this Ross, the self tacker has been removed so seems like your solution would work well for what we want, and would definitely simplify sailing two-handed. 

A change to the rig system definitely is in the works, so any pics you have of the system would be greatly appreciated🙂  

Do you have a fine tune or some sort of system for adjusting each individually, either while under load or before pulling the tension on? 

Cheers

[Marshy 30]

When i bought Mercenary it had inline jumpers too - and a reasonably large roached main that caught the backstay when gybing.

We swept the jumpers aft (and i actually converted it to cathedral) but just swept aft jumpers can help hold the top up long enough to flick the backstay off the top of the main - it is a trade off in that the main cant ease quite as far at the top - but something to consider. Otherwise its running topmast backstays...