ab1974 1 Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Looking at fitting a retractable bow sprit on my E7.9 (like the one that Selden do). Want to get a gennaker built for some more fun off the wind particularly when either short handed racing or when cruising with the wife. When cruising we tend to stick to white sails which can be a little boring but with a pregnant wife and a 2yo trying to convince her to get the spinnaker up is near impossible. Any thoughts on pros and cons for racing and cruising? Should I bother with the sprit or just fly the gennaker of the bow roller (which extends about 250mm out from the bow). Cons: - Cost - Takes up some foredeck space - Will make access to anchor locker a little bit more painful - but nothing serious Pros: - Maybe easier to gybe - Better performance Others??? Link to post Share on other sites
ab1974 1 Posted May 5, 2011 Author Share Posted May 5, 2011 Sprit would be about 1400mm out from the bow when extended. Link to post Share on other sites
Atom Ant 0 Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Off a prod keeps it away from the forestay when gybing. That is a good thing. Link to post Share on other sites
Mothership 6 Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Also good for preventing boats from tacking through, apparently: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=16568 Link to post Share on other sites
Changed 10 Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 Prod will also help to balance the helm, extend the J distance and allow a bigger sail to be set. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 5, 2011 Share Posted May 5, 2011 If for cruising and a bit of racing why not a rotating one? Maybe PM Grunta and get him to e-mail you some photos of the one on the Grunty Chicken. Link to post Share on other sites
ab1974 1 Posted May 5, 2011 Author Share Posted May 5, 2011 Had thought about it but to be honest the Selden option follows the KISS principle and allows me to remove it easily. Link to post Share on other sites
ab1974 1 Posted May 9, 2011 Author Share Posted May 9, 2011 Bugger it, have ordered it. Will be 1500mm when extended. Can't understand the $$ though. Cost me NZ$600 in the UK. Would have been $1300+ here for exactly the same thing. Have a mate who is bringing a shipping container back when he moves in a few weeks so cost me $0 freight. I have ordered other bits and bobs overseas as well. I know the old argument of supporting local but when things are twice the price it is hard to swallow. Local support and warranty issues aside (which someone is paying for in the country overseas) it just doesn't make sense to me. Can demand and shipping costs really make that much difference. I'm guessing the local retailers are working on similar margins but maybe not? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 You want to complain about the price of sailing in NZ? Bottom line is that the big companies are ripping us off in general. For example: I got one of these watches from NZ Sailing for $120. This watch is from the company that makes the Ronstan Clear Start. The RRP for the Ronstan version is $225. NZ Sailing sells the Ronstan for $190. Even then, Ronstan are taking a $70 (58%) markup on the basic watch. This has nothing to do with NZ Sailings pricing and I thank them for offering good pricing on good gear! http://www.nzsailing.net/optimum-time-s ... 09801.html A few of us used to wear these gloves when sailing Starling. Back then, they didn't have a Zhik logo on them - they weren't even considered sailing gloves. Ok, Zhik have lowered their price to $12.50 AUS, but they used to be more than that. Know how much we paid? $1.50 from Palmers Garden Centre. http://www.zhik.com/ProductDetails.aspx ... ategoryID= Thankfully, the local guys have been doing their best to keep the price of sailing down and they have a lot of knowledge they are willing to pass on. To me, it is worth paying a bit more for the effort they put in. BUT, like you I won't pay 8 times the price for a pair of gloves nor twice the price for a bowsprit. Good on you for getting it cheap. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Those Zhik gloves are just the gardening ones in different colours. I was talking to a pom who sails 29ers over there who found a source of the gardening ones online for 1 pound/pair when they buy them by the box of 50 or something. Disposable at the end of each day racing. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 A lot pay for the 'brand'. We have just scored some fittings. Looking at them and we though 'bugger me these are XXX's and YYY's'. XXX and YYY being 2 very big brand names in sailing. So I asked our supplier, a EU manufacturer, 'You buy these off XXX and YYY?'. The answer was 'No, we make then for XXX and YYY'. We can sell them for around 20% of the exact same XXX and YYY branded ones. There are a few very well known, and often 'respected' brands who use that and their muscle to control the market and in doing so keep the prices 'up there'. If that pisses a few off here they wouldn't care for more than a second as NZ is probably a huge 0.0001% of their business. There are a multitude of products equal or better than most 'big brand name' ones and at sharper, often by a lot, pricing but often people seem to think if it's got a big name on it the better it is. More often than knot people are paying a big sum just to have that name on a product when in reality it makes zero difference to it's performance. I have a classic example of that you all could relate to easily but sadly I'd be found dead if I said it out loud. You'd laugh your tits off if I could say more, and do so in a very proud to be a Kiwi way. The world today is all 'sell the Brand' rather than the product. Many of those Brands don't actually make squat so you are paying for a few, in some cases a multitude, of ticket clippers that are in the supply chain. And NZ is tiny. I know what a large retail marine chain pays for a range of items in the US, it's around 40% less than one does here. But then they sell more in one month than everyone in NZ would sell in a year, maybe even 2 years. The price they and NZ pays totally reflects the respective buying power. As the one or 2 very large outfits buy up all the smaller ones around the world, as is happening at the moment, price breaks will only become more common and with that often large differences in the retail price. But in with this is the very strong NZ$, if that was tracking the more normal rates, or what was the norm, the gaps we see at the moment wouldn't be as large as they appear. But then I had to suss a very well known marine product last week. The NZ price was 'Yucky, or so I thought so went sussing. As it turned out buying one in NZ was about 25% cheaper than buying one from offshore. Close to 40% cheaper than buying one from Aussie. So it's knot totally one way traffic so to speak. And the average NZ yachtie is both lazy and squeaks when they walk. We hear it a lot 'Wa wa wa.. I was in at XXX Marine and the prices are sh*t'. Well then drive 5min down the road and it'll be cheaper. Almost all marine retailers are in areas where they are because you want the convenience. All of those 'convenient place for you to shop' areas also attract huge rents, rates and costs. You do have to pay to be lazy but then it is your choice when you do so. And don't forget any offshore company has an instant 15% price advantage over a NZ one. At the same time if you shop offshore don't go bitching about tax dodging, crap roads or the lack of nurses Link to post Share on other sites
ab1974 1 Posted May 9, 2011 Author Share Posted May 9, 2011 While part of the last para I agree with, I paid 20% VAT in the UK rather than 15% GST here and it was still less than half the price for exactly the same product / brand. I would much rather pay NZ GST than another country's tax so as to contribute at home. I like nurses too ...... Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 OK so you probably aren't a good example AB, with the offshore GST thing but you get my drift, they are some of the reasons smaller countries just pay more. And I didn't mention most of the stuff we want here has to travel more miles to get here than to any other country in the world. Glad to see you like Nurses also Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 OK so you probably aren't a good example AB, with the offshore GST thing but you get my drift, they are some of the reasons smaller countries just pay more. And I didn't mention most of the stuff we want here has to travel more miles to get here than to any other country in the world. Glad to see you like Nurses also Yay for nurses Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Thread drift anyone? Link to post Share on other sites
Murky 1 Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Certainly does help - thanks Toles. Can't believe some people consider thread drift to be a bad thing... Link to post Share on other sites
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