Island Time 1,239 Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 The other day I was talking to a guy in this marina who is setting up his launch to live on for a few months while a new house is being built. He has installed a Califont in the cockpit (so it's outside..), but was saying he could not get anyone to either install it, nor certify the install and do a WOF. I was just wondering how many, (if any), of you have a gas WOF, an, if so, who did it for you? Oh, and the poll is private, so no-one knows how you voted! Thanks Matt Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Farrari 4 Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 Is there such a thing as a gas WOF? Last time I went through the process of getting Cat 3 I had a gas fitter to check my boats gas installation. He said he could only certify a new install and there was no mechanism in the regulations to certify or warrant existing installs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,239 Posted April 26, 2016 Author Share Posted April 26, 2016 Interesting. I have no idea. Seems to be lots of contradicting info out there.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ScottiE 174 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 https://www.standards.govt.nz/touchstone/energy/2013/oct/latest-gas-installation-standards-published-as-nzs-5601-1---2-2013/ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 These Gvt outfits are great at making info clear eh.....not.So do I understand this correctly then. A new installation needs to meet compliance and I assume the installer thus gives you a compliance cert. But no on going WOF like electrical requires. Is that correct? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
waikiore 400 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 There was a young yachty from Tauranga, working in Auckland for a time who was charging for and issueing gas warrants, when I questioned him as to which standard and who we should show them to he disappeared. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 After the chat he brushed it with soapy water and found no leaks so is staying with the flexible tubing that is purpose built to be used as a gas line according to the markings on it...... in all countries not called NZ apparently. Without reading the regs, I think max length of a hose is 1.5. There is a good reason why Flexible hoses are not allowed for a long installed length. There is no flexible plastic that is gas proof. They all "breath" and slowly leak gas through them. When i was working for ENZED, double lined high pressure gas hoses(used before a regulator) had to have the outer sheath pricked with little holes so as to let gas that seeps through from the inner lining out. Otherwise the gas gets trapped and causes the outer sheath to bubble into blisters. To this day, I still do not know why they make a purpose made Gas hose that you tehn have to prick the outer sheath to let the gas through. You may as well just have one layer. The brown LPG hose is also twin lined. But you don't have to prick that stuff as it is low pressure after the reg. I never knew plastics breathed till i was working on packaging machinery some years later. They had a special plastic they use to seal lozenges like strepsils for instance. That clear plastic is three layers and they are actually glued together with a resin to make it impervious to moisture and air. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 Let me add to that. It leaks so slowly, you will not see bubbles if you put soapy water on it.And in saying all that, i have the brown flexi LPG hose installed in my boat. When the gas has been off for several months, it takes ages to bleed fresh gas back through the hose before a burner will light. But there has never ever been enough leaking to set of a gas detector and I have about 10M of hose running through the vessel. I also have Copper tube running a further 5m to the Oven and the Force 10 heater. One day I will get around to installing Copper all the way. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin McCready 83 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 Another good reason to switch off at the bottle. I switch off just before I'm finished cooking, precisely to bleed the line. And I save .00001 of a cent each time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,239 Posted April 27, 2016 Author Share Posted April 27, 2016 Hmm, the only problem I have had with leaks on Island time has been the old copper. Behind the "furniture" of course. That bit has been replaced with flexible gas hose. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 I also think a major reason for copper is Fire. For Survey, Fuel lines that are steel or Steel braided are required for that reason. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
marinheiro 352 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 Matt, As you know I had some gas work done before Xmas (the morning of Xmas Eve to be precise!) This consisted of replacing the flexible hoses at the bottle and stove ends, new regulator and solenoid and removing the Califont, with a pressure test.. Following this work I was issued a certificate by a third party (not the gas fitter) titled "Gas Fitting Certificate of Compliance - Gas safety Certificate" Gas fitting work was done by Aquaplumb - Malcolm Pollard Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,239 Posted April 27, 2016 Author Share Posted April 27, 2016 Ok,Gas Fitting Certificate of Compliance, that's the name I was after. Anyone else got one? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ScottiE 174 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 A not unrelated topic that I recall was recently discussed. http://crew.org.nz/forum/index.php/topic/5787-gas-bottles/ Matt - almost feels like we need a sticky topic on this one. I've periodically been researching this over the last 12 months but frankly the whole topic is just horribly fragmented! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ex TL systems 63 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 I always used to only turn my cylinder on a half turn or so but have since found that some will leak at the valve if not opened all the way up. ie they seal fully open or fully closed but inbetween some will leak through the spindle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ScottiE 174 Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 Also recall another topic about gas lockers in the last few months? Anyone find it? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
marinheiro 352 Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Scottie, I was advised that the gas locker is supposed to have an air inlet of approx 75mm and a drain of 19mm, per the code AG 601 - have not seen this in writing. I asked what the intent of the air inlet was - advice was this was to stop condensation/humidity in the locker. Mine is stone dry so I am not cutting another hole in the boat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JK 28 Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 https://www.scribd.com/doc/267729821/AS-NZS-5601-2-2013 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ScottiE 174 Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 The YNZ safety regs call for a sealed locker cover with a drain! If you're saying you also need a 75mm inlet (which makes sense - need an inlet for venturi to work) then why even have a cover? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Crocket 12 Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 The leak rate on a flexible hose would be almost unmeasurable. A valve seat or stem seal would allow the line to drop pressure before the low pressure gas permeates through the hose. We only have issues with leakage in flexible lines when we are dealing with small molecule gases like Hydrogen or Helium. Then we move to a product called Tefzel. However, Wheels is right. A flexible hose will blister if the outer sheath is not allowed to breathe. Also remember a Stainless Braided line is still a flexible Plastic, or nylon, or Teflon line inside. Its only an outer braided sheath to protect hose hose. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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