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2:1 Main Halyard and running


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I want to change the main halyard to a 2:1.  There is a lot of weight in the main and the load of the full battens makes it time consuming to shake out a reef, it cannot be done without winching. 

I can see that when we put in a 2:1 into the mast head crane that the 2:1 is going to stop the top of the sail from being able to twist sideways. 

With a square top I see this putting a lot of sideways load on the headboard. 

I see a lot of boats with square tops running 2:1 halyards but I can't see how they eliminate this problem of stopping the headboard from turning outboard. 

Anyone aware of a hinged headboard with a fixed hoist point?  I don't want a rotating shackle on the halyard as this risks halyard twist. 

Thanks. 

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Hey CD 

2:1 Halyard on the main is brilliant.  We changed Oliver Sudden to 2:1 shortly after going Square Top.  Less load on the rope and clutches + less slippage.  Easier to hoist.  
Dog bone to the top of the crane as close to the existing sheave exit position.  Works well and doesn't affect the head position.  

I've flicked you a direct message with some images on the set-up of our "hinged headboard".  Not removing the top batten.  Perhaps that helps.  

Cheers

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5 hours ago, ex Elly said:

Wouldn't the new halyard attach to the same point on the headboard?  If so, then would the new halyard actually make much difference to the sideways movement of the head?

Yes, but now there are two ropes stopping the headboard from twisting.  The same as why you use a 2:1 on the downhaul for Code Zero furler - to stop the Furler from twisting.  If you have one rope going to the bottom of the furler the rope can twist on itself and so the furler spins on the centre line of the rope (a mistake I will not make again), so adding a 2:1 the two ropes prevent the furler from spinning.

4 hours ago, ballystick said:

Cation has a nice system for the halyard and the squaretop, check out the BoatingNZ video. This may not be applicable for you though!

Thanks.  That's the Doyle Anomaly Headboard.  I can't see how it doesn't suffer from the problem I am trying to resolve.

2 hours ago, Sudden5869 said:

2:1 Halyard on the main is brilliant.  We changed Oliver Sudden to 2:1 shortly after going Square Top.  Less load on the rope and clutches + less slippage.  Easier to hoist.  Dog bone to the top of the crane as close to the existing sheave exit position.  Works well and doesn't affect the head position.

Thanks for that - it's a neat idea and solves another annoyance I have which is taking pins in and out of the square top so we can put the sail cover on.

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I think the reason I have a problem is because the main makes maximum use of the hoist height, the 2:1 will stop it turning, just like a 2:1 stops a furler from spinning. It seems other setups use webbing to connect the sail to the headboard, with the webbing, the headboard can stay on the centreline (or close to it) and the sail actually rotates around the headboard.  Because my sail is sandwiched between two bits of metal headboard, my sail will need to fold/bend around the headboard.

Don't know if this makes sense, I am struggling to explain it, I tried to draw a picture but that was worse.

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We've used a 2:1 for about four years. First on a square top that needed to have the top batten removed and now on a pseudo-square top that does not require the batten removal step. Both sails have/had about 20% roach. The new headboard has a cutout for the 2:1 block, such that the block fits in this cutout 'window'. This helps when you have a nearly full-hoist main as you describe.  After about 15,000 offshore miles on the second main, we don't see any problem with the sail 'hinging' at the metal headboard (plates on both sides bolted/rivited together. The headboard is on an Antal car system that has slider 'bushings' (not ball bearings) and these cars are connected to the headboard wing 30mm webbing straps with about 25mm between the car and  headboard. (The mainsail is DP Hydranet... so may be more resistant to the hinging you are concerned about?)

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On 14/11/2020 at 8:43 AM, 2flit said:

We've used a 2:1 for about four years. First on a square top that needed to have the top batten removed and now on a pseudo-square top that does not require the batten removal step. Both sails have/had about 20% roach. The new headboard has a cutout for the 2:1 block, such that the block fits in this cutout 'window'. This helps when you have a nearly full-hoist main as you describe.  After about 15,000 offshore miles on the second main, we don't see any problem with the sail 'hinging' at the metal headboard (plates on both sides bolted/rivited together. The headboard is on an Antal car system that has slider 'bushings' (not ball bearings) and these cars are connected to the headboard wing 30mm webbing straps with about 25mm between the car and  headboard. (The mainsail is DP Hydranet... so may be more resistant to the hinging you are concerned about?)

Thanks. Appreciate the details. Would love a photo of your headboard? I assume it's a custom build... 

Your setup sounds the same as ours, except for the the built in block, which would only make the issue I am concerned about worse.

I feel I am creating an issue where one does not exist, so I will convert to a 2:1 and see how it goes... 

Thanks all. 

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