Call for Licensing

[harrytom 690]

I am sure everyone on here has never made a mistake, has done all the relevant courses, never exceeds 5 knots where prohibited, never rowed ashore without a PFD etc.

 

Those registered jetskis never break any rules right?

 

Some enforcement would go along way.  Along with and first, some serious public education.

The problem the way I see it,we are going to be penalized for those who we just cannot get through too or dont care,same group who drink/drug/drive     they are probably the same ones who have the rotted ply hartley and no lifejackets, I came in through Manukau heads last friday(never again) and there just off cake island(tipitai head) 10ft  parker craft with 6 ;largest guys fishing,no jackets waving beer cans These are type who no matter how hard  you try to educate will carry on doing it . You fine them??so what(pay $5 pw) go and get another boat?? There is no easy answer until we have a bonefide water police division.

[harrytom 690]

Pretty sure any vessel over 24m or 12 passengers is considered commercial, and require qualified crew.

www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/motorboats/auction-1580309906.htm?rsqid=d0b6540a493e4e618d1ffd1b933e7af7

 

 

What ticket or licence do you need to run this boat

bry53 (1 ) 5:15 pm, Wed 6 Jun

A. The vessel is in private register so you do not need any licence. You just have to learn how to drive the vessel. 12:58 pm, Thu 7 Jun

[Fish 0]

and there just off cake island(tipitai head) 10ft  parker craft with 6 ;largest guys fishing,no jackets waving beer cans These are type who no matter how hard  you try to educate will carry on doing it . You fine them??so what(pay $5 pw) go and get another boat?? There is no easy answer until we have a bonefide water police division.

Sounds like they were having a good time. Hope you waved back.

Doesn't sound like they did anything to impact on your good day out, so why do we need licencing because of that example?

 

I can't see what the problem is that needs licencing as a solution.

[Fish 0]

 

www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/motorboats/auction-1580309906.htm?rsqid=d0b6540a493e4e618d1ffd1b933e7af7

 

 

What ticket or licence do you need to run this boat

bry53 (1 ) 5:15 pm, Wed 6 Jun

A. The vessel is in private register so you do not need any licence. You just have to learn how to drive the vessel. 12:58 pm, Thu 7 Jun

 

Trademe is a great source of factual information, like my car has only had one careful lady owner...

 

And note, that reply did say 'you have to learn how to drive the boat', which I would have thought includes learning your port and starboard, and how to give way to others...

I'm not getting a licence cause of Q&A on trademe, thank you.

[harrytom 690]

Sounds like they were having a good time. Hope you waved back.

Doesn't sound like they did anything to impact on your good day out, so why do we need licencing because of that example?

 

I can't see what the problem is that needs licencing as a solution.

No immediate problem correct,but chances are very good of had a problem,out going tide 2m swell on bar and they were just from the white water,motor fail, fall in? I was in 5.7m 90hp horse and skipper was working hard to keep wave at stern and bow from not running over wave in front. Had they got in trouble all we would be able to is vhf or cell police,c/g and it would 2 hrs or more before anyone got to them.

[Fish 0]

No immediate problem correct,

So if there was no problem, what do we need licencing for?

Would licencing have made any difference to that example anyway?

Would the government be better putting the time and costs of a licencing system into, say, education, suicide prevention, more nurses?

 

If you look at the issues and challenges facing society today, does errant boat drivers really warrant time? I'd rather they sort out all the deaths and harm from synthetic cannabis than a couple of fizz boats passing too close. I'm sure those guys had a nice day on the water and got some good fish for their families. The fact that they didn't get into trouble speaks volumes. And from the implied social demographic of that example, I'd say getting some good food for their kids was a worthwhile undertaking for them. 

[Fish 0]

Watch the first minute of this video and see if you want 'on the water policing'.

 

Solo sailor starting out on a trip to Hawaii, gets bordered by Coast Guard and has to show all his safety gear, including 'throwing cushions' i.e. life rings (he's solo, can't throw one to himself). Gets a ticket for some minor noncompliance. 

 

This is literally jackboots on deck, going through your boat material. You think a fizzy passing too close puts you in a bad mood, how about being boardered for inspection and compliance of the regulations...

 

https://youtu.be/28TAdDu5L6U

[Guest 000]

Sounds like they were having a good time. Hope you waved back.

Doesn't sound like they did anything to impact on your good day out, so why do we need licencing because of that example?

 

I can't see what the problem is that needs licencing as a solution.

Well I can see a potential problem.

We as sailors need to get our house in order and be proactive with regard to on water behaviour and education. I would prefer that boaties did that rather than having some bureaucrat wake up one morning saying sh*t, there's a lot of drowning out there on thd water plus a lot of unseamanlike behaviour. Better start introducing a raft load of regs. That'll put a damper on those rich prices..

[Hurts 6]

So if there was no problem, what do we need licencing for?

Would licencing have made any difference to that example anyway?

Would the government be better putting the time and costs of a licencing system into, say, education, suicide prevention, more nurses?

 

If you look at the issues and challenges facing society today, does errant boat drivers really warrant time? I'd rather they sort out all the deaths and harm from synthetic cannabis than a couple of fizz boats passing too close. I'm sure those guys had a nice day on the water and got some good fish for their families. The fact that they didn't get into trouble speaks volumes. And from the implied social demographic of that example, I'd say getting some good food for their kids was a worthwhile undertaking for them.

 

+1 don’t give fun police more power. Freedom to take your own risks is one of the best things about NZ and we have other more important issues.

[Guest 000]

So if there was no problem, what do we need licencing for?

Would licencing have made any difference to that example anyway?

Would the government be better putting the time and costs of a licencing system into, say, education, suicide prevention, more nurses?

 

If you look at the issues and challenges facing society today, does errant boat drivers really warrant time? I'd rather they sort out all the deaths and harm from synthetic cannabis than a couple of fizz boats passing too close. I'm sure those guys had a nice day on the water and got some good fish for their families. The fact that they didn't get into trouble speaks volumes. And from the implied social demographic of that example, I'd say getting some good food for their kids was a worthwhile undertaking for them.

 

If they were guzzling beer then I would propose that trying to feed their kids was not the primary objective.

[John B 112]

Every time somebody thinks something needs fixing, they leap for a new law or regulation instead of enforcing what already exists. The list of laws/regs in our society keeps growing but without enforcement, they're meaningless anyway. Start with education and some peer pressure doesn't hurt either and then enforce what currently exists. If after all that is done properly and a problem still exists then find a way to target that problem with a new reg/law without adding unnecessary sweeping laws impacting all.

I agree, the OP says as long as it's not about revenue gathering. It's always about revenue gathering, Australia is a nightmare of over compliance on the water,so is the US.Give them a leg in and its empire building and justification of expense by "results". Results means tickets and earnings.

Invite them in and watch them take our lifestyle from us.

 

Just enforce the rules that exist, pull a few heads in in the demographic that needs it,we don't need any more legislation.

[Black Panther 1,745]

According to NZ I'm not capable of doing most of the things I've been doing for over 60 yrs.

[Fish 0]

If they were guzzling beer then I would propose that trying to feed their kids was not the primary objective.

That point is mildly difficult to argue with.

1-nil to Chrisc

[Fish 0]

According to NZ I'm not capable of doing most of the things I've been doing for over 60 yrs.

I'm reading David Lewis book Icebird. Sailed solo to Antartica, forgot gloves, didn't have a heater, bilge pump wouldn't work. Had no idea where he was half the time, and forgot to have hot drinks or food for several weeks. Complete nutter. Left two young kids at home, oh, didn't have any money, didn't have a boat 3 months before departing.

Arrived home a hero.

 

Its beyond me how any exploration of the world or our oceans would have got done with today's regulations.

Kind of explains why it so hard to get anything done at all.

[Steve Pope 253]

The two main issues I see are power boats going too fast, too close to other boats and the other is jet skis too fast too close to shore. With the later I cannot believe more swimmers haven’t had their skulls smacked in although a few have.

one of the last to die was "allegedly" by a Harbour board vessel. Can't be much more licensed than that.

[Dagwood 69]

The article answers the issue:

 

"Barnett said compliance of water rules was generally good when the harbourmasters were on the water, but reports from the public suggested some people reverted to speeding when they were not visible. "

 

So the issue is not one of education or a license. It's enforcement / accountability. Register the boats with numbers before we go down the license route. That way it's slightly easier to hold people accountable. 

[Crazyhorse 47]

I am pretty sure if you could convince the regional councils and the government that there is a veritable fortune racing about everyday breaking any and all the rules (it feels like that at times!), all that revenue just waiting to be harvested by fines and seizures, maybe, just maybe some will start paying attention to speed etc. Licences just mean someone has had to at leased prove some knowledge of COLREGs or even the basics, isn't that a start? More and more vessels in the water and it's becoming open slather out there yet how many times do you see any patrol vessel out on the water other than main cities like Auckland?

[cj! 19]

Last Saturday I did one of those 'Ride Forever' motorcycle have you your sh*t together courses that are heavily supported by ACC. I had no idea what to expect but found it magnificent......so if you are a 2 wheeler I'd very highly recommend doing one or more, you can do 3 or 4 a year for the price of a couple of coffees, ACC picks up the rest. Search 'Ride for Forever ACC' and your local options should pop up.

 

Anyway when we were back debriefing, after a 350km ride around northland, I found out if I show my insurance company the Course certificate the remove any excess i have. Another insurance mob refund any course costs in the way of lowered premiums. Another also reduced premiums quite a considerable amount. Interestingly 3 of the 5 on the course said if they had known that they may have done the course earlier. That tells me people will do a course if there is a financial benefit for them and that it does not have to be a huge benefit.

 

Get the marine insurance company's to lift premiums a bit then if a boater can show them say a Boat Masters cert the insurance company drops the rates or does similar to the motorbike mobs. Do a coastal YM and get a bit more off, a Ocean YM and them maybe get no excess on top again.

 

Encouragement and benefits will work better than big sticks.

 

I like this idea.  

[Beccara 25]

Maybe license the boats rather than the skipper? Like the Jet Skis do? It seems like there's enough rules but you need reporting and follow up which is hard when it's just "Generic 6m fizz boat"

[Fish 0]

I am pretty sure if you could convince the regional councils and the government that there is a veritable fortune racing about everyday breaking any and all the rules (it feels like that at times!), all that revenue just waiting to be harvested by fines and seizures, maybe, just maybe some will start paying attention to speed etc. Licences just mean someone has had to at leased prove some knowledge of COLREGs or even the basics, isn't that a start? More and more vessels in the water and it's becoming open slather out there yet how many times do you see any patrol vessel out on the water other than main cities like Auckland?

Not necessarily.

One of the licence types, an Aussie based on, suitable to use for chartering yachts in Europe, just requires you to get a tinnie off the wharf, do a loop, and back onto the wharf.

Oh, and pay a fee...

 

 

And,

if people need to learn the COLREGS, why aren't there loads of crashes / accidents / property damage?