State of boating in General in NZ

[wheels 543]

I think it is fair to say, many are hurting finacially at the moment. It is in many ways, sad to see so many boats being listed forsale in some cases, below fire sale prices.

I have just read the latest news letter from Marlborough Berthholders and Moorings Association (MBMA). Funny, I wrote an email to them ruffly two yrs ago saying that boating is becoming unaffordable in Marlborough due to exhorbitant Marina fees. I was hoohaard somewhat with the typical, "well we are more expensive than you and so and so is more expensive" and yadda yadda. So I sighed and said, well we are off to Auckland. Yes the Marina's are slightly more expensive, but there are many other options available which Marlborough does not have. So see ya later.

Well funny enough, the news letter has just echoed my same concerns with the Marl. Marinas dropping dramaticaly in patronage. Havelock now has over 90 empty berths. Three years ago, Port Marl. was telling us there was a waiting list for Havelock and Waikawa had a two yr waiting list. There are now many empty berths in Waikawa and many many boats going on the market with the reason being told by owners that the cost is too high to keep the boat.

 

So what are the views of everyone ??? Is it cost of marinas that is becoming a concern? Cost of maintenance??? Or everything coming together that is making boating a Rich mans past time???

[Fogg 427]

Most people with boats are not rich... because they own a boat.

[Guest]

I see it as an agglomeration of factors.

NZ'ers are poorer now than they were in the 60's and 70's.

The wealth has moved out of the middle class to the top 10-15% (my estimate).

Owning a boat has become more expensive. Marina costs, moorings,rates, insurance, maintenance have all gone up.

Add it all up and you need to be wealthy now to own a boat in NZ, and it is getting worse not better.

Consider that the average income is around $50k for an individual, $80k for a household. Then deduct tax, accommodation, food, clothing, transportation cost, power, phone............

Certainly in Auckland that is barely scraping by and hardly luxurious living elsewhere. Then consider that half the population is below that level.

 

Unfortunately I expect to get shouted down by people saying "I have a boat but I'm not wealthy". But people always consider things from their own perspective, wherever you are on the ladder looks normal to you. And if you own a boat, chances are a number of your friends and acquantainces do too, and owning a boat seems "normal". Guess what - it isn't.

 

 

All the above predicated on a boat that is large enough to live permanently in the water

[Kiteroa 8]

From my experience, you spend time or money. If you're pressed for time, then you better be rich. If you're like me, 30yrs old with a house and a boat, but no family or kids, then you can substitute a good chunk of the financial pain with hard work and a bit of time spent. Although i'm in the industry and I make great use of various connections and trade accounts about the place. If I had a family and worked in an un-useful (non marine type) profession, owning a racing keel yacht would be near impossible.

[sow1ld 2]

I'm 32 single x boatbuilder work as a marine engineer on the ferries so get paid well & I struggle to keep my cav 36 in top order. Sometimes I think its getting there then I look at the pics on the ssanz web page & just about every body has flash kevlar carbon sails &i get dispondent! I wonder how they afford the flash sails! I def think to keep a36footer in top order is an expensive game and I do 99% of the work myself!

[Zoe 8]

I have said this for a long time, but I think there continues to be a lot of unrealised opportunity for yachting in NZ. The sport doesn't need to be expensive - well okay it's never going to be cheap either but essentially, the water and the wind are free, and dacron and and aluminium are all that you need, so long as your aspirations are realistic.

 

I think it's about what people want to make it.

[wheels 543]

So do I take from this that you all think the Marina charges are fine.

[Guest]

just about every body has flash kevlar carbon sails

But does it mean they know who to take advantage of those or are just using them to help offset bad sailing skills???

 

So I'm going with exactly what Zoe said. Many, most???, people have desires beyond their wallets and the skills they have to employ said desires.

 

Had someone today genuinely surprised I don't have a chart plotter. He was even more surprised to find the only instrument I have aboard is a speedo nothing more. I still have as just as much fun as the next boat, often more.

 

No Wheels, marina charges are sh*t and are playing on the boundary of total bullshit.

[wheels 543]

At least you have a speedo, I'd hate to see you in nothing more

[Guest Saturday Night Special]

The sport can be cheap it just needs clubs to change their attitude and encompas all boats and yes marina charges are sh*t

[sealegs 0]

Im extremely new to the sport. Im a family of 6 with both parents working on a pretty average income & like most average households my size where I dont have much spare cash once Ive sorted out the budget priorities

For me marina fees are outside of my reach. I have to resort to a swing mooring and even then I had to search for a really long time for a cheap one that suites my boat AND budget.

The cost of maintaining is perhaps more than I bargained for but I am trying hard to keep it up as its one of those rare activities we as a family can enjoy together.

 

I cannot compare the cost of boating with anything else because its my first ever opportunity to even own a yacht & Im nearly 50.

 

I did notice that anything with the word "marine" on its label is gonna cost an arm & a leg and I try and hide that cost from the missus whenever I need to purchase something for the boat...

 

If the cost does get higher it will be a very sad day for me to give up my newly found joy...

[Guest]

I think boating is as expensive as you want it to be.

 

I have a 26ft boat on the marina. Yes it costs allot of money but I think it's worth it.

 

True cost of boating = cost of boat & expences / number of times you use it. So I use it as often as I can.

 

Sure, racing boats are suffering because it's much more expensive to run etc... But i am sure the true cruising yachties are much the same as they have always been

 

You don't get your money back but you get your money's worth

 

For me, I can't think of anything better to do with my money than owing a boat

 

I also think marinas should be cheaper but at half moon bay, there are no spare bearths so you pat what you need to unfortunately

[sow1ld 2]

I think it's important to try not to get sucked into the jones mentality although in guilty! Mariner rent haulout fees etc are all bloody expensive I could never afford to own a boat if I had to pay someone to do the work! I race & cruise my boat. I'm sure that amps the costs up but I wouldn't be without a boat I'd be a grumpy miserable old fart! You know what boat stands for right Bring On Another Thousand!

[Megwyn 2]

In all reality, we probably cannot afford a yacht like RO. But there is no way that I will let her suffer because of it!

Like someone said, maintenance is numero uno. You do what you know you have to do to keep your baby up and running in fine fettle.

 

Don't use marina's. I can have a solar shower off the back of the boat.

 

I do think there is a perception that people that own yachts are rich. I disagree. I learnt years ago when I was a single parent that you can afford what you need, and you can have what you want. You just have to be clever with your money. ie - if you want it, really want it, get it. The means will follow.

 

Lol - back down the rabbit hole

[Guest]

Also remember that on this site you are talking to people who own boats, we have no measure of those who have opted out.

[Zoe 8]

So do I take from this that you all think the Marina charges are fine.

 

I dunno. I sold my keeler when I was pregnant with my first child six years ago, because I knew i wouldn't have the time or money for it! But instead I am sailing a dinghy on a road trailer and having just as much fun - in fact I love it every time I go out. Cost = road trailer reg, yacht club membership and race fees, occassional bits and pieces for the boat so maybe $500 per year.

 

I am keen to improve the boat, but figure I will do that when I am making no mistakes on the water!

 

I guess you could say I'm sailing within my means.

[Guest]

But Zoe, as the general population becomes less well off, more people will do as you did, so the keeler fleet will shrink. And those that can't afford trailer sailers will move to dinghies and the trailer fleets will shrink, and those that can't afford a dinghy will disappear altogether.

 

It's a fact, we are poorer than we were, and the cost of owning a boat is going up. Wherever you want to put the line, it is moving and not in a good direction.

 

Think of it like this. When the price of petrol doubles again, and the price of food for your family of six doubles, and your husband gets made redundant and has to take a job at 60% of his current income, and your rates go up , and power costs go up. Eventually the day will come when you say, "I'll sell the boat, can't afford it any more". That day has already happened for a lot of people. And unless something dramatic happens, I don't see the trend turning around any time soon.

[Murky 1]

Also remember that on this site you are talking to people who own boats, we have no measure of those who have opted out.

...or whether boating has been any more or less affected than any other pastime involving a high-value initial investment and ongoing costs for a non-essential asset.

 

I guess most of us here keep a close eye on boat and marina prices but I suspect we would find a similar trend with - stab-in-the-dark examples here - classic cars, sections in Wanaka etc?

 

Also picking up on one of Motorbike's comments above re the costs of professional maintenance. Our family boating when I was a kid took place on a boat that hit the water with very little paid input (mates pitching in). The maintenance programme took place through winter haulouts at a co-operative type club and the topsides got an annual coat of house paint, brushed on, generally in a farking cold SW. A visit to a chandlery happened almost never. There were no marinas at the time so that wasn't an option.

 

I don't disagree that costs have gone up but also expectations/what is considered "normal".

[Zoe 8]

I am more optimistic than you, David.

 

I believe the world is a better place than it ever was.

 

In the words of the famous John Dyson:

Figures compiled for the KPMG report show the following global changes over the last 20 years: a 163% increase in GDP, with a 21% reduction in resource intensity and 23% lower CO2 emissions per unit GDP, a 19% improvement in the UNDP human development index, an 18% reduction in undernourishment, and a 31% drop in average annual population growth rate.

 

The problem is not whether people have the ability to go sailing, it is whether they want to enough to make the necessary effort.

 

Apathy has long been the sport's biggest downfall. Fifty years ago the members of French Bay Yacht Club gave up their weekends for months on end to build our reclamation and get the clubhouse underway. Five years ago the committee held a meeting to consider putting the club into abeyance. Thank goodness it didn't. With a lot of hard work since then, the club has been turned around and this weekend our commodore spoke at the YNZ Commodore's Conference on how we have become one of the most active and fastest growing clubs in NZ. Our catchment is local families probably on above average incomes, but certainly not hugely wealthy people. You don't see fancy European cars towing their dinghies. We are on the shores of the Manukau which is generally considered second rate to the east coast beaches - even though we think it's a great place to sail esp in a South Westerly. All we have really done is take what we have got, tell people it is there, and kept on telling them - and given it to them in a format that they fits in with their lives, at a realistic cost. Yes it has taken a lot of hard work but we aren't digging foundations with spades, we are sitting out our computers writing newsletters and organizing Try Sailing days, getting signage printed, and in committee meetings to make sure that the club's infrastructure is in good shape to support the fleet, and that the volunteer roster is organized to have someone on ramp duty and someone on the committee boat and someone in the kitchen getting the sausage sizzle organized.

 

We have got it so good and if we are letting it slip through our fingers, it's our own fault, not anyone else's. Along with everyone else we are competing for scarce resources, whether that be somewhere to park your car because the marina where you keep your boat is a short walk from the CBD, or money for safety boats. Enough people just have to be keen enough to fight for it, but it's not exactly going to war, it's just common sense, enthusiasm, and continued application.

 

As I say, it's what you make it.

[Fogg 427]

But Zoe, as the general population becomes less well off, more people will do as you did, so the keeler fleet will shrink. And those that can't afford trailer sailers will move to dinghies and the trailer fleets will shrink, and those that can't afford a dinghy will disappear altogether.

 

It's a fact, we are poorer than we were, and the cost of owning a boat is going up. Wherever you want to put the line, it is moving and not in a good direction.

 

Think of it like this. When the price of petrol doubles again, and the price of food for your family of six doubles, and your husband gets made redundant and has to take a job at 60% of his current income, and your rates go up , and power costs go up. Eventually the day will come when you say, "I'll sell the boat, can't afford it any more". That day has already happened for a lot of people. And unless something dramatic happens, I don't see the trend turning around any time soon.

 

Been on the happy pills again, Ogre?

 

Not sure flogging houses is good for your soul, Ogre. Might be turning you into an Angry Ogre? Or a Grumpy Ogre? Or a Dark Ogre? Or mebe (but I'm being charitable here) just a reflective Ogre, like this?