GME MT403 EPIRB

[ALBECH 1]

Just ran into this issue with an MT406G and have been told by GME that these units cannot have the batteries replaced or unit refurbished . Quite baffling as this should be a high spec electronics piece of equipment. I guess things can always fail but in my experience its rare these days, I  cannot remember when something of this nature has failed at home, car etc and the electronic components involved would be of significantly less quality build than an EPIRB. I agree with no short cuts on safety but if you want to be 100% safe then not venturing out might be the best option.  Seems like the manufacturer is simply trying to make me buy a new unit with there is nothing really wrong with the old one.

[mischief 5]

have just been through the same.  Was going to be $550 to replace the batteries in my ACR global fix (arguably a better EPIRB with global coverage, not just NZ/OZ) for a 5 year battery.  Instead purchased an Ocean Signal rescue-me for $399 with a 10 year battery.  both with GPS etc.  no brainer for what I need (sadly)

[aardvarkash10 1,138]

32 minutes ago, ALBECH said:

Just ran into this issue with an MT406G and have been told by GME that these units cannot have the batteries replaced or unit refurbished ...

Their website says otherwise

gme.net.au/nz/beacon-information/

Cost of $229 given for refurbishment, 1 year warranty.

 

[CarpeDiem 535]

24 minutes ago, ALBECH said:

Just ran into this issue with an MT406G and have been told by GME that these units cannot have the batteries replaced or unit refurbished . Quite baffling as this should be a high spec electronics piece of equipment. I guess things can always fail but in my experience its rare these days, I  cannot remember when something of this nature has failed at home, car etc and the electronic components involved would be of significantly less quality build than an EPIRB. I agree with no short cuts on safety but if you want to be 100% safe then not venturing out might be the best option.  Seems like the manufacturer is simply trying to make me buy a new unit with there is nothing really wrong with the old one.

It's about both failure and also about the supporting technology changing.  GME decided these units should have a life of 12 years.  So after 12 yrs they will no longer service them. 

The 406g only uses the GPS gnss service provided by the usa. Since the product was made there have 4 other gnss satelites added by 4 other countries thus greatly increasing both the accuracy and time to fix.  Any current model gps will use all available gnss providers.

Tge 406g is also only equipped with a single band receiver (L1) because when it was designed multiple bands did not exist except for military use.  Current models will use dual bands greatly increasing accuracy. 

If I look at my cell phone gnss receiver from 10 yrs ago compare it to my current the difference is an order of magnitude of improvement.

My current phone gets a fix in 3 seconds and has an accuracy of 1.8m.

Those same improvements will also be in the transmission side of the product as well because all the technology has improved.

 

[ballystick 79]

What do you do with the old GME units, apart from sending them to the tip and triggering an alert?

[CarpeDiem 535]

1 hour ago, ballystick said:

What do you do with the old GME units, apart from sending them to the tip and triggering an alert?

You can open them, remove the batteries.

Drop them in your council recycling bin.  They don't like it, but they do the right thing at the sorting table. 

Do not put the batteries in the council kerb side bin incase they cause a fire. 

You can add them to your personal e-waste collection and take them to the once a year e-waste in your area. 

Some places that sell epirbs will take your old ones and dispose of them. 

Spark Vodafone and 2deg will probably accept them in there e-waste phone bins if you ask nicely and explain that they are just a big phone. 

[ALBECH 1]

I bought my unit in 2014 so its only 8 years old. The issue according to GME is that the battery wasn't replaced at the right interval (due to COVID) and therefore cannot be refurbished. A heap of BS. 

I'm an inshore sailor who is after something which is going to be of use should my yacht, VHF, phones, tender etc all fail me and it just annoys me that GME have the cheek to suggest (have decided) that these units are not serviceable.

My recommendation is that we give GME a very wide berth because they are not actually interested in safety at sea.

[aardvarkash10 1,138]

46 minutes ago, ALBECH said:

I bought my unit in 2014 so its only 8 years old.

But the design is older.

Same thing with android devices.  It doesn't matter when you bought the device, the service life is from the date of software release.

I have a perfectly functional Chromebook that goes out of support next month at the end of its 5 years of support.  You could still buy the same item last year and no doubt many buyers are now scratching their heads and cursing.

The manufacturer carries significant liability for the functionality of these safety devices.  If they have criteria for determining the device life, I would expect them to stick to it.

Given replacement is about $500, or about $5 a month of ownership, I'd just accept it as a cost of safe operation.

FWIW, GME's 600 series EPIRB carries a six year warranty and a ten year battery service life.  I paid $329 for ours, so $2.75 a month for its service life.  Cheap.

[ex Elly 267]

17 hours ago, ballystick said:

What do you do with the old GME units, apart from sending them to the tip and triggering an alert?

I took mine to the local police station, who then send it to Beacons NZ to be disposed of properly.

[ex Elly 267]

My 406G expired last year. I contacted GME and could have replaced the batteries for $240. New ones would have lasted 6 years.

Did the maths and bought a new MT600G with 10 year batteries. 

Cost was around $40 per year for old unit with 6 years life, versus $40 per year for new unit with 10 year span.

 

[CarpeDiem 535]

1 hour ago, ALBECH said:

I bought my unit in 2014 so its only 8 years old.

My recommendation is that we give GME a very wide berth because they are not actually interested in safety at sea.

It's quite the opposite actually.

These requirements are set in the EPIRB standards it's not something the GME have come up with.  They aren't cutting corners, they know that there is a plethora of choice out there, they have nothing to gain by pissing you off, because they are following a standard, they know you could well go to another vendor.  Would you prefer that they put new batteries in it took your money and sent you on your way with a "your epirb now doesn't meet the NZ safety standard, but she'll be right mate..."

They probably just lost your business and lost revenue because they are putting safety at sea first.

They have a clear standard that they have communicated.  Your device with a 2 yr expired battery does not meet the standard and is considered past it's useful life.

[ALBECH 1]

You are correct, I would prefer they fitted new batteries and sent me on my way. I would make that choice because I know there is actually nothing wrong with the unit and with new batteries it would be fit for the purpose I intend using it. It has a test function hence the potential for latent failure is small and when combined with the other safety precautions, overall risk is very small.

The standard looks like a lot of things these days OTT. It would be interesting to see if GME and the legislators have published any MTF (mean time between failure) statistics which relate to their warranty and serviceability limits. I doubt it somehow.

[aardvarkash10 1,138]

3 hours ago, ALBECH said:

The standard looks like a lot of things these days OTT.

Child car seats.

Liferafts.

Safety harnesses and tethers.

The WOF on my car.

Structural Engineer's Practising Licences.  (actually, on second thoughts, perhaps they are too lax...)

Medications.

Food sold to consumers ready-to-eat.

Driver licences.

Credit Cards.

Software licences.

Aircraft components.

Just a quick list of things that meet a broad definition of "stuff that seems to be too conservatively lifespan rated because I (me, maybe not you) don't understand it, but perhaps someone knows more than me".

 

[CarpeDiem 535]

5 hours ago, ALBECH said:

You are correct, I would prefer they fitted new batteries and sent me on my way. 

So I personally think it's actually yourself that's not taking safety at sea seriously and you're trying to deflect that onto GME. What do you think? 

If you'd like to send it to me I will replace the batteries for $229 (same price as GME).  I can buy them on AliExpress for $27 incl p&p. I won't do any of the other 67 checks that GME say they do cause (a) I don't know what they are; and (b) I don't have the specialised equipment.

Fortunately you've already asserted that the unit has nothing wrong with it so I won't need to worry about your safety from failure of the unit. 

Ps: that test button doesn't test that the unit actually works, it only does an internal circuitry test. It doesn't transmit or receive. You can run the test in a Faraday cage and it will pass.

That test button is as good as the airbag test in your car.

pps: that was sarcasm, please don't send me your epirb

[CarpeDiem 535]

1 hour ago, aardvarkash10 said:

Credit Cards. 

Why do credit cards expire? That's definitely dumber than a epirb expiring. 

[aardvarkash10 1,138]

Just now, CarpeDiem said:

Why do credit cards expire? That's definitely dumber than a epirb expiring. 

so they can issue you a new one with the bank's new logo and a larger credit limit to keep you permanently in hock

Sheesh.  Capitalism 101

[ALBECH 1]

I am not sure you have understood my post. I cannot get the unit serviced  or battery replaced by the vendor because I dd not have the battery changed within a proscribed period. The option of the vendor doing the extensive testing is not available to me. I perhaps don't have as deep pockets as some so will try and make do. I do have quite a bit of experience in reliability engineering in the oil and gas area. The components within my EPIRB should result in the device having a SIL (safety integrity level) rating suitable for a very low probability of failure on demand. A presumably high spec piece of equipment such as an EPIRB should not in my opinion experience performance degradation over what is a relatively short space of time and GME's demands that I buy a new one and give me zero service options makes me query their motives. With respect to the OTT comment I made, within my circles there is a generally accepted point of view that we are over regulated. Thanks for the tip on where to get replacement batteries.

 

[aardvarkash10 1,138]

2 minutes ago, ALBECH said:

I am not sure you have understood my post. I cannot get the unit serviced  or battery replaced by the vendor because I dd not have the battery changed within a proscribed period...Thanks for the tip on where to get replacement batteries.

 

I don't see the commercial interest the company might have in refusing to service your device vs selling you a new one.  At the price they quote for the work there is presumably a reasonable profit margin, and they carry very low ongoing warranty risk (1 year).  Presumably they have also figured out the pissed off customer cost as well.

Given all the things you are assuming and considering your advice about your acceptance of risk, it looks like self servicing is the option for you.  Good luck!

 

[splat 57]

From a purely rational perspective - it is cheaper to simply buy a new unit at $399 on special with a 10 year service and battery life that the manufacturer certifies.  To dispose of a unit, you simply break the unit open and disconnect the power supply - then dispose of the battery carefully.

[Black Panther 1,775]

I always wonder at a warranty on an item like this. If it fails who is around to claim the warranty?