Martin Wright 1 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 Hello My mecahnic thinks I need to replace my v-drive. It's a "Viking Vee-Drive" and it's probably 47 years old dating back to when my Cavalier 32 was built. The engine faces to the fore, and the engine's drive reverses (through the v-drive) to connect with the propellor shaft which comes through the hull under the engine. So far, all my internet searches have turned up nothing similar to the unit I have. I wonder if any knowledgeale old salts can advise what I should do? Thanks for your help in advance. Martin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
marinheiro 352 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 9 hours ago, Martin Wright said: Hello My mecahnic thinks I need to replace my v-drive. It's a "Viking Vee-Drive" and it's probably 47 years old dating back to when my Cavalier 32 was built. The engine faces to the fore, and the engine's drive reverses (through the v-drive) to connect with the propellor shaft which comes through the hull under the engine. So far, all my internet searches have turned up nothing similar to the unit I have. I wonder if any knowledgeale old salts can advise what I should do? Thanks for your help in advance. Martin This was locally made (they also used to make stern drives) but any trace of the company would be long gone. Has it actually been opened up for inspection? I would expect it is fairly simple inside just some bearings, gears and most likely dog clutches for shifting. The bearings and gears would be easy enough to replace, the dog clutches might be a bit more of a challenge. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Pope 243 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 the Dog clutches could be built up and be able to live another equally lengthy life. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fish 0 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 When you say your mechanic thinks it needs replacing, what problems are you actually having with it? Any marine item at 47 yrs old I would think most professionals would say it 'needs' replacing. You'd be hard pushed to find an option as solid in today's gearboxes, and would think a refurb would be least expense, esp for the quality of the gear. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 Beta do a V-drive https://betamarine.co.uk/resources/GA_Drawings/Seagoing/B30-ZF15MIV/#page=1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
waikiore 399 Posted March 21, 2021 Share Posted March 21, 2021 Bill Falconer had a spare one a while ago 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin Wright 1 Posted March 22, 2021 Author Share Posted March 22, 2021 10 hours ago, Fish said: When you say your mechanic thinks it needs replacing, what problems are you actually having with it? Any marine item at 47 yrs old I would think most professionals would say it 'needs' replacing. You'd be hard pushed to find an option as solid in today's gearboxes, and would think a refurb would be least expense, esp for the quality of the gear. Hi Fish. My mechanic sent it to some eperts to be "tested", but they said that two of the threaded bindings jad broken. That means they can't reseal the unit once they open it. Hence me asking for advice. Thanks for responding. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin Wright 1 Posted March 22, 2021 Author Share Posted March 22, 2021 10 hours ago, Dtwo said: Beta do a V-drive https://betamarine.co.uk/resources/GA_Drawings/Seagoing/B30-ZF15MIV/#page=1 Thanks for this. I have seen that model on line. I think it's a ZF, but mine is remotely located, ie it's not attached to the engine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fish 0 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 10 hours ago, Martin Wright said: Hi Fish. My mechanic sent it to some eperts to be "tested", but they said that two of the threaded bindings jad broken. That means they can't reseal the unit once they open it. Hence me asking for advice. Thanks for responding. Hi Martin, I was more wondering why you started looking at it, was it leaking oil, not going into gear, no drive at all? We had a 35 year old PRM 220 gearbox on an Isuzu 38. Very solid, hydraulic gear box, not made any more. The output bearing was worn, so it was hard to get engine alignment, consequently we found it was leaking oil, but that wasn't apparent at the time. I had 'experts' look over the whole engine and gearbox (we ended up replacing the whole lot with a new Beta 35). And we got the gearbox upgraded from the standard spec to the modern equivalent of the old gearbox, still by PRM (Beta will supply anything you want with their engines). I found that experts, especially ones with good reputations in the industry, they are risk adverse in terms of doing a job that may not be completely perfect. They don't want disputes, they don't want come backs, and more to the point, they can't offer warranties on work on gearboxes that are already 47 years old. So they will say it is "unserviceable", and you need to replace it. Depending on your appetite for cost and risk, you could take it to any old mechanic and replace or service the bits that are giving trouble. It may not be perfect, it may only last five years, or two years, no one really knows, and that risk is yours. It could last for 10 yrs. It may only cost a modest amount compared to a new gearbox. I do know that new gearboxes are built much lighter (lower spec) than the solid old ones. They are built to a price, and the work load (duty point) is carefully matched so that it works just fine, but they are definitely not over spec'd like the old ones. It can be a tough call putting expensive new components onto a boat that is already 'well used'. It can be like pulling a string on a sweater, everything unravelling. First this, then that etc. Good luck with it. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chariot 243 Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 I had a remotely located ZF box on our Cav 32. Took it to the agents and what a bloody disaster. Went in as a V drive and I got it back as a straight drive. That's what you get when the experts have a play with it. I would look at options away from V drive units. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Panther 1,587 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 My cav i put in a little Volvo with sail drive. Meant the engine went back under the cockpit and opened a lot of space in the cabin. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chariot 243 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 3 hours ago, Black Panther said: My cav i put in a little Volvo with sail drive. Meant the engine went back under the cockpit and opened a lot of space in the cabin. I believe that would be the best option. Probably what I would have done if I had kept the Cav. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin Wright 1 Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 10 hours ago, chariot said: I had a remotely located ZF box on our Cav 32. Took it to the agents and what a bloody disaster. Went in as a V drive and I got it back as a straight drive. That's what you get when the experts have a play with it. I would look at options away from V drive units. Hi Chariot. Thats the thing: what options are there "away from v drive units"? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin Wright 1 Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 3 hours ago, chariot said: I believe that would be the best option. Probably what I would have done if I had kept the Cav. Yes, I am considering that idea. But it seems likely that it would cost more because of the reconfiguration of drive shaft etc. Do you think the sail drive would work when the engine faces forward? The point where the drive shaft exits the gear box is a long forward of the actualy position of the propellor. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin Wright 1 Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 On 22/03/2021 at 12:01 PM, waikiore said: Bill Falconer had a spare one a while ago Thanks for the tip. I contacted Bill. He says he has a "kanzaki". I'll jhave to look it up on Google. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Martin Wright 1 Posted March 23, 2021 Author Share Posted March 23, 2021 12 hours ago, Fish said: I found that experts, especially ones with good reputations in the industry, they are risk adverse in terms of doing a job that may not be completely perfect. They don't want disputes, they don't want come backs, and more to the point, they can't offer warranties on work on gearboxes that are already 47 years old. So they will say it is "unserviceable", and you need to replace it. You may have hit the nail on the head here. The initial problem was that the thrust bearing broke, so the propellor shaft went backwards about 70mm when we put the engine into reverse (to lay anchor). Paddy (of Paddy Marine) says he does a "complete job" and won't touch it unless the whole drive train is tested. That includes the v-drive. When he took the v-drive to be tested (not sure by whom) they said that because two of the threaded bolt-holes were broken, that they would not be able to seal the unit after inspection. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jim s 34 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 Any chance of some photos of the problem pieces? Where are you located? It may be perfectly viable to restore. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
marinheiro 352 Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 57 minutes ago, Martin Wright said: Thanks for the tip. I contacted Bill. He says he has a "kanzaki". I'll jhave to look it up on Google. that is a japanese gearbox normally fitted to Yanmars, it would bolt up to the bell housing whereas you have a remote mounted vee drive. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shackleton 2 Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 I have used an argo in the past as a replacement remote V drive. See argorace.com.au/product/v-drive. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
aardvarkash10 960 Posted March 24, 2021 Share Posted March 24, 2021 Who is this Bill Falconer of which everyone speaks? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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