Dtwo 157 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 I am aware that conventional wisdom tells us to use muriatic/hydrochloric acid to free head piping from calcium buildup. I was wondering if Coca Cola would work just as well. Anyone tried it? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,239 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 Don’t use those acids on an alloy head! It’s ok on cast iron and copper tubing. I prefer phosphoric acid myself. Less dangerous, and work s great. Never tried coke, might work, but I’d imagine very slowly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 Coke has Phosphoric acid added, but as IT says, it is a very week solution. It is also not a good acid for dissolving Calcium. In fact, it can make things worse. The formula for Phosphoric Acid is H3PO4. Without getting to complicated, after the acid as reacted with the calcium, there is a spare Phosphate ion left to roam around and that combines with a Calcium Ion to form Calcium Phosphate which is insoluble. For Calcium scale, you need acids that are high in Hydrogen Ions. Hydrochloric (muriatic) Acid is best for disolving scale, Sulfuric acid second best. But great care must be taken with both these Acids. They are both very strong when concentrated and can cause severe burns and damage eyes. They both corrode metals. A concentration of around 10% is all that is needed. Oxalic Acid is another good one to try and it is the best for removing Rust stains as it is also called a chelating acid.Oxalic Acid can be bought in a white crystal form from most hardware stores as it is used for cleaning timber. CLR uses Sulfamic acid, which also works and is much safer to use. CLR comes with a concentration of about 8%. If you want a more friendly acid for the environment and yourself, try either Acetic Acid(white vinegar) or Citric Acid. Citric Acid can be bought from Hardware stores as a white crystaline poweder sold as a concrete surface etch/cleaner.But these last two are weak and take a lot longer to work. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Panther 1,592 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 Muriatic acid Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,239 Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 Interesting Wheels. I use phosphoric acid as its the primary ingredient of barnacle buster... http://www.proactivemarine.com.au/sites/default/files/MSDS-Barnacle_Buster.pdf Quote Link to post Share on other sites
wheels 543 Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 How well does it work IT?I think it tends to get used in many various such cleaning products because it is safe for the environment and safe should you get it on your skin. Oxalic acid is better, but it is toxic to us. And for hydrochloric acid, even in a very weak solution, I doubt it would be safe enough to apply. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Island Time 1,239 Posted June 27, 2019 Share Posted June 27, 2019 Hi Wheels, seems to work pretty well. Not as well - or nearly as aggressive - as hydrochloric, but pretty well. Barnacle buster is pretty expensive! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
whitepointer 34 Posted June 29, 2019 Share Posted June 29, 2019 i recall in a previous boat that had an electrosan treatment unit installed that the manufacturer recommended using Muriatic acid at about 10% mix, soaked for an hour then flushed out, seemed to do the job, never had any toilet blockage issues Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Terry B 71 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Soooo, phosphoric acid is the consensus then? Or not? Do you dilute? If so to what percentage? And do you just flush it through the entire toilet system or do you unhook hoses and only do them (hope not, PITA)? And how often do you use it? Do you flush through or let it stand in the pipes for xxx time? Sorry, might be dumb questions I built a plywood holding tank with about a million coats of epoxy on it last year. Might be exagerating on the number of coats . Works great, I'd never thought much about the calcium build up though. I have the standard jabsco toilet. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Pope 243 Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Not sure about Loos but when I clean out the heat exchangers I use a 5 (water) to 1 (phosphoric acid) mix, takes all of 10 minutes for all the calcium deposits to be disolved, no harm to metals etc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Frank 157 Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 for what it is worth on the aircraft lav plumbing we use Acetic acid same as what you find in Vinegar. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Terry B 71 Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 KM, I just used epoxy coats, nothing else. I saw some things John Wellsford had written about making these and he reckoned just epoxy was fine. I was going to put a removable lid on it but in the end I sealed it all up. Couldn't stand the thought of leaks - waste or smell! Can't see inside at all!! I have relatively straight inlet & outlet hoses to the tank so should be (yeah right) simple to clear any blockages without disassembling everything. I slanted the bottom of the tank toward the outlet pipe so (hopefully) it empties completely when flushed with fresh water. Which I do every time I'm back in the slip. Worst comes to worst - i build a new one from scrap plywood again in 5 years or so.........or slice the top off with a skilsaw or on the table saw, clean it up and epoxy it back together. So far, I'm very pleased. I only built one myself as the space was small and awkward and I would have only got a 15L version of the plastic ones into the space. I now have 32L capacity. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vic008 17 Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hoping you find big enough, mine at 30L, wishing it was bigger.Really only for emergency use anyway. Big advocate for a level gauge- you really need to know the level.Bought an Amazon portable,thru plastic,etc but while works on the kettle no good on tank. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Terry B 71 Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Vic - because I can't 'see' the tank level, I'm going to work out how many pumps to a full tank Will do this in spring when I next have at least a 3-4 day trip. That way I can get a rough idea of toilet visits per tank - at least on average anyway. Everyone on board has to write down number of pumps each time it's used - hopefully I can work out roughly when it's getting close to full that way. Careful eye on the vent overflowing........... Cabin boys task, that.......... Might also be a sh:)storm.............. I normally sail solo or 2 up. Rarely more than that, so with 'judicious' use, 32L should be fine. Ain't got more room for a larger tank unless I do major surgery and I'm not going to do that. And KM - hopefully my novice tank building doesn't give you a false sense of security! Before building it, I did talk to lottsa people and google was my friend. As was Brian (a plug for Burnsco here) at Burnsco who's advice was brilliant. Staff got a dozen beer as reward. Also, a mate built one out of ply with only epoxy on it and it has happily worked for around 7 years now with no issues - and they use the boat a lot. Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ynot 45 Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Remember in theory the vent should be as big as the inlet. This allows air to flow in and out through the same hole which let's things and stuff work right and apparently let's micro things do their stuff. (in a septic tank anyway but in a yacht probably does not sit long enough to let them do Thier stuff) Well designed waste tanks will not smell. However in a yacht a 38mm vent pipe probably is not what most people are willing to do. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
marinheiro 352 Posted July 3, 2019 Share Posted July 3, 2019 Vic - because I can't 'see' the tank level, I'm going to work out how many pumps to a full tank Will do this in spring when I next have at least a 3-4 day trip. That way I can get a rough idea of toilet visits per tank - at least on average anyway. Everyone on board has to write down number of pumps each time it's used - hopefully I can work out roughly when it's getting close to full that way. If you want to "double" the tank capacity, have a separate bin for loo paper. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dtwo 157 Posted July 3, 2019 Author Share Posted July 3, 2019 One of the most important things with holding tanks is to lose the wire mesh from the breather vent. If you have repeated overfill "events", bog paper does a papier mache trick and blocks the vent, creating the ultimate shitstorm. How do I know that? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sail Rock 28 Posted July 4, 2019 Share Posted July 4, 2019 I reconditioned head and holding tank on my boat a couple of years ago. Used Barnacle Buster to descale the disassembled parts of the head and to loosen heavy scale from plastic holding tank which then flaked off with a few light taps on the outside. BB is expensive but works a treat. You can reuse the solution several times by decanting to remove the sludge but obviously it’s concentration and hence effectiveness diminishes. Sanitary pipes were so heavily scaled that I had to remove them and replace with a combination of domestic PVC sanitary pipes and elbows and rigid hose bought from Burnsco. Like KM, it was an installation within a shoebox! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vic008 17 Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 Does anyone know how clean the tank inside gets after a clean,? Currently soaking with that Aqua blue or green stuff inside. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
splat 55 Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 aqua green or blue is not a tank cleaner - they are waste treatments - sure it will help keep it clean but not cleaner Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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