Seafaring nation?

[Black Panther 751]

1 hour ago, Fish said:

You asked me that yesterday. I'd sail to NZ, we are far more reasonable than the French.

My point is, this thing was framed as a humanitarian issue, "We must get out of the Pacific or face certain death from Cyclones".

People around here have been posting as if the NZ govt are turning away Syrian refugees arriving at out border. That would be a humanitarian issue. Right at the start, in one of the press releases, one of these cruisers said they didn't want to pay the $1,000 application fee to go into Fiji. What is wrong with going to Fiji, they will let you in.

In reality, the issue is they don't want to overstay in FP, and can't get a visa extension. This whole issue is being dressed up as something that it is not.

I wonder if that is correct.  Yesterday for the first time I heard the guy from OCC speak.  There was none of that  he was accurate and low key, even when pushed by the interviewer  .  So i wonder how much of that could be attributed to the media. 

[Fish 726]

The first post in this thread is based on a Herald article. The Herald is renowned for click bait journalism and being economical with facts so as to present one side of a story, to work people up into a lather and click on more headlines...

However, RNZ did report this statement from the Ocean Cruising Clud:

The club said lives and property were at risk, but the latest official response revealed a misunderstanding around the logistics of boat travel.

 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/426508/foreign-yachties-say-lives-now-at-risk-from-nz-decision

[Black Panther 751]

If Fiji is the only other legal option then i guess its a game of Russian roulette.  300 boats, say 600 people at a guess, in Fiji for the season. Could be OK. Could be mayhem.

[KM... 952]

2 hours ago, Black Panther said:

I wonder if that is correct.  Yesterday for the first time I heard the guy from OCC speak.  There was none of that  he was accurate and low key, even when pushed by the interviewer  .  So i wonder how much of that could be attributed to the media. 

I heard that and he struggled to put up any form of solid case and he sounded a little winey. I thought it was more harmful than helpful.

600 people in Fiji would, or could if so many weren't tight arses, have a big impact on their economy, way bigger and arguably way more needed there than they would do for the NZ economy.

[2flit 24]

So.... If we are taking about the specific case of the Germans; They are EU citizens and can remain in French Polynesia. They would not have been kicked out of FP or had their "time run out"

 

[44forty 98]

30 minutes ago, 2flit said:

So.... If we are taking about the specific case of the Germans; They are EU citizens and can remain in French Polynesia. They would not have been kicked out of FP or had their "time run out"

 

Tuamotus are pretty desolate if you stay too long and Papeete is hella expensive and has Covid .

I reckon they went for the soft touch option and free flight home .

[Fish 726]

Anyone want to comment on the legal requirements of ships crew leaving ships in a foreign port? Surely these guys don't need a visa to get from the port to the airport? They are allowed off the ship to go and see a GP, if it is arranged with via the ships agent, aren't they?

If a yacht made commercial arrangements to park up a boat for a while, what is to stop them from sailing into NZ, all the foreign crew using the commercial ships crew legal rights to get from the port to the airport, flying home, and leaving the boat in a marina or such like?

[Black Panther 751]

You are all guessing as we do not have all the information. 

[Vivaldi 21]

They are in custody after appearing in the District Court awaiting deportation. 

[CarpeDiem 37]

 

1 hour ago, Fish said:

Surely these guys don't need a visa to get from the port to the airport?

So this is not different to flying into Auckland, catching a domestic flight to Wellington, and departing for Australia.  A visa is of course required for this.  Even flight crew overnighting are issued special Visa's.

"these guys", to just get to the Airport, (a) needed an exemption for their vessel; (b) needed a exemption for entry under the critical workers rules; (c) needed to be granted a Visa (d) needed to comply with isolation requirements

These are the same rules that apply to a commercial vessel and its crew.

[Fish 726]

Quite a few actual details in this story. Sounds a bit harsh putting them in Mt Eden, when they could be at the Rydges or something.

Can't help but think they are being made an example of. Would be interested in a maritime law point of view, if they have a leaking boat and damaged mast, surely they'd be allowed safe harbour?

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/427201/german-yachties-jailed-until-flight-on-thursday

[CarpeDiem 37]

48 minutes ago, Fish said:

Would be interested in a maritime law point of view, if they have a leaking boat and damaged mast, surely they'd be allowed safe harbour?

Section 13 of the border order states that if a ship is in distress and/or it is necessary to preserve human life, then the clauses which prevent non-New Zealand citizens or foreign vessels from entering do not apply. In those circumstances, vessels will be allowed to enter New Zealand.

However, any deliberate attempt to contravene the order would be liable for prosecution and may result in a $15,000 NZD fine, imprisonment of up to 12 months, or forfeiture of the vessel.

I can't see how this section could possibly apply to any vessel unless it's on the way to/from Antarctica.  It's not like they were throwing in a quick circumnavigation of NZ on the way to Fiji and decided to stop for repairs.

There is also nothing to suggest that they declared an emergency.  Had they declared an emergency while still awaiting the result of their exemption application the outcome might of been different for them.

The article implies that the damage occurred before they received the rejection and that they then chose to continue to NZ.

[Fish 726]

A maritime lawyer says there may be a legal argument for allowing foreign yachts into New Zealand when they can prove where they have been through electronic tracking.

Hundreds denied entry because of the border closure have tried convincing authorities they pose no threat because of the time it takes to sail here.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/427309/electronic-tracking-of-yachts-possible-legal-argument-for-their-entry-to-new-zealand

[Sabre 351]

That doesn't sound like much of a legal argument to me. 

Still don't get why the NZ government is being such a dick about this whole situation though.

 

[Fish 726]

No, I didn't think there was anything legal about it.

I think the govt is being a dick about it, cause there is an election in 3 weeks time. And I think these Duetch have been made an example of, and are hard done by.

[vic008 17]

You,se guys didn't see the pontoon parties they had while the rest of us were locked down

[Fish 726]

2 minutes ago, vic008 said:

You,se guys didn't see the pontoon parties they had while the rest of us were locked down

Was that in NZ, or in covid ridden Tahiti?

[dutyfree 91]

I think the Government is being dicks.  They  have generated such a level of fear that reason has gone out the window.

[marinheiro 203]

1 hour ago, dutyfree said:

I think the Government is being dicks.  They  have generated such a level of fear that reason has gone out the window.

and yet there seems to be international flights continuing to arrive almost daily from India (rapidly catching up to USA's case count), almost always carrying at least 1 COVID case. Of the 12 cases announced today 10 came from India. 

go figure??

[KM... 952]

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