Okahu Hard Stand meeting

[K4309 257]

Last chance to submit your feedback on the Landing Hardstand closing. Consultation closes this week.

It is an easy form to fill out.

The Landing Concept Plan (Pathways to the Sea) | AK Have Your Say (aucklandcouncil.govt.nz)

[Bradz 18]

7 hours ago, Timberwolfy said:

That would be equally hilarious and infuriating that it got that far. This whole situation is an ugly bad dream for me.

 

https://www.yachtingnz.org.nz/news/landing-okahu-bay-last-chance-have-your-say

 

Great looking boat in the link there Liz!

[dutyfree 170]

So i rode through  the landing in the weekend.  quite interesting as there were quite a lot of dinghies etc. All lined up along the ramp, rigging, getting ready, some foil sailors rigging up, a couple of out rigger guys.  Guess what?  None of them were using the hard stand area, not one.

It is interesting that the park proponent holds out a range of potential and occasional events, that may or may not ever be held there, versus the "mere 300" boats" a year that used the area continuously. There is already a massive park nearby if it recall........  So the hard stand needs to shut just in case an event is held there, one day, hopefully, maybe.......and anyway, boat owners are all rich pricks.  Plus they cry, look at the RNZYC, its loosing money, we just need to wake up and realise that boating/yachting is all over. I own a boat, I dont need a club, I do need haulout facilities. Yes that is a selfish position, but so is yours,you have your own vested interest associate with your preferences, and I have mine.

As for conspiracies, we dont need them.  A primary RAYC committee member and proponent of shutting the landing absolutely owns a competing haulout facility. I think most people see that for what it is, a massive conflict of interest.

Standard practice is to recuse yourself.  Now I reported it to the Commerce Commission, I doubt they will do anything, but they should.

[Psyche 633]

Did anyone mention that Okahu bay has been a haul out since pre European times?

[Okahu Sailor 16]

Interesting being accused of being selfish when advocating that a park should be able to be used be everyone not a just a niche group. 

The skate park thing is false equivalence - the hardstand was the skate board servicing shop (of which there are plenty more - albeit some may not specialise in your particular niche of skating), not the skate park (the equivalent would be the harbour) which I'm definitely against being paved over (looking at Ports of Auckland). 

I don't represent RAYC merely a member that agrees with the committee and I don't represent or have anything to do with Tamaki Marine Park so I'm not going to comment on it other then to say I don't see why mine and others support of closure should be contingent on someone else who may or may not have a conflict - I don't know and I don't care it has nothing to do with me. I'll also point out when the former contractor of the Landing commented on here no one was clamouring to point out their conflict nor am I suggesting that you can't hold your own opinion because you happen to agree with him.

If I didn't live in the area and hadn't looked into the detail I would probably be pro hardstand as well, its easy enough to support the status quo. Sticking your neck out and suggesting a change that is for the greater good of harbour users long term is much harder to do, especially when confronted by an extremely vocal minority. 

 

[waikiore 399]

As someone who grew up in that very area and who raced and built skiffs on that hardstand -and rowed in earlier years -then maintained our own keelboats there -I find your assertion that closing the hardstand is for the greater good of harbour users mystifying and totally illogical. There is a perfectly good under utilised park right next door -where I also played rugby on occasion . Akkers (that I once was a proud member of ) needs to stop trying to control their surrounds and stick to their knitting . I note the total membership has taken a dive since those heady days of the 60's 70's and early 80's when they fostered real keel yachting with piedies 1/4 tonners half tonners -the Balokovic (one of my favourites) white Island Fiji etc. Also while this keel boat racing was occurring we had plenty of dinghy racing off the ramp -probably more than now -taking the M class as an example. What boating I wonder does Okahu sailor actively participate in?

[Timberwolfy 62]

Quote

The skate park thing is false equivalence

I was merely riffing off your comment that, "If a golf course, rugby field, cricket pitch, skate park, basketball court was under utilised and better served the community as something else then yes that should at the very least be explored." You are either moving the goalposts or creating a strawman argument by saying now, no, you mean a skate shop. But hey, I'm impressed you've stuck around so long after announcing you won't be back, so I will amend my metaphor to work within your changed parameters:

If a skate school pushed for the closure of the skate shop next door so they had more space to store their and their members' gear, despite this causing there to be less than 33% capacity for all other skaters to have their regular required maintenance done, this would be a problem. If all the other skaters were pleading for this shop to remain open because, as stated, there is not enough capacity in the area to support them continuing in the hobby, this would be a problem.

If the national skateboard governing authority and all the other skate clubs (except, of course, the school that wants to store their gear there) in the area were saying, "hey, we shouldn't be closing this skate shop as it's really integral to the needs of many, many local skateboarders," this would not be a "vocal minority."

 

This isn't only about niche tris; I just happen to love one. This, plus the closure of Pier 21, restrictions on LSBB, and Orams going big-boat-big-money-only, impacts all keelboats in Auckland, particularly the smaller ones on smaller budgets. As a skater would say: "so not cool, man."

 

Quote

I don't know and I don't care it has nothing to do with me

If this doesn't sum up your whole attitude towards other people's needs/wants, nothing does.

[Plato 11]

The Marine Center was to accommodate ALL waterborne activities. Now it seems that RAYC have become the dominant voice Thank you ratepayers for rebuilding the clubhouse. Now Fergus kayaks are being disposed of for a modern paddling center with 'çlub rooms' Duplication of spaces leads to underutilization of all spaces.

The 'modern wakas' should continue to be hauled out and worked on as a continuation of past use. Why we need another park is beyond me. How much better to have a 7 days a week activity center as a point of difference and point of interest along Tamaki Drive. 

Unfortunately the council are asking for comments on HOW before adequately resolving the WHAT It is just very, very lazy planning with no foresight. If we're not careful we will have a dead facility which we will long regret, as once its gone its gone-GONE!!

[harrytom 643]

2 hours ago, Timberwolfy said:

"If a golf course, rugby field, cricket pitch, skate park, basketball court was under utilised and better served the community

Manukau sold their golf course off(takanin) now houses and shops. I see the same happening at Pakuranga,apartments being built on the course where the water feature was.

[dutyfree 170]

Your used by everyone is just a strawman argument.  It is quite clear that there is already a large areas that can be used by everybody.  It is equally clear that there was an area that was highly used (note you did not respond to my position that it was used continuously while your uses are just occasional fantasies) that you want to be available to the amorphous "everyone".

Saying you have the greater good at heart is pretty lame.  I have the greater good of the whole marine ecosystem at heart via clean boats - there your go, trumped your moral superiority.

[Jono G 41]

Yes it has been getting harder for the average boatie for years. But that doesn't mean we allow the trend to continue. And for me the two real issues are capacity for yachts with masts in. Then accessibility for boats in the central harbour. In recent years we have lost the ability to paint on the grid at Westhaven, then we lost the grid at Westhaven. Then we lost Pier 21. I read the list of grids posted. Take away the club grids, the height restricted grids, and the grids past Rangi light or Browns Island and you are left with HMB, Orams, Hobsonville and the Landing. And guess what - as ratepayers we own the Landing, a Trust owns HMB and the other 2 are privately owned.  Of course we want to protect our resource.

I believe the RAYC / Marine Trust / Tamaki Park factor is a side issue - an unfortunate side issue, but as much emotive as substantive.

[Psyche 633]

On 21/09/2023 at 9:34 AM, waikiore said:

As someone who grew up in that very area and who raced and built skiffs on that hardstand -and rowed in earlier years -then maintained our own keelboats there -I find your assertion that closing the hardstand is for the greater good of harbour users mystifying and totally illogical. There is a perfectly good under utilised park right next door -where I also played rugby on occasion . Akkers (that I once was a proud member of ) needs to stop trying to control their surrounds and stick to their knitting . I note the total membership has taken a dive since those heady days of the 60's 70's and early 80's when they fostered real keel yachting with piedies 1/4 tonners half tonners -the Balokovic (one of my favourites) white Island Fiji etc. Also while this keel boat racing was occurring we had plenty of dinghy racing off the ramp -probably more than now -taking the M class as an example. What boating I wonder does Okahu sailor actively participate in?

When we were sailing R's at Okahu Bay, the class shed had a couple of 18's (Smirnoff and Captain Morgan ring a bell) sailing out of there  Every weekend there were Cherubs, R's, M's plus an assortment of cats in far greater numbers than the 470's and 29ers of today. The Auckland sailing club was busy, there were at least a dozen M's stored on trailers next to it, the mooring field was packed, and the hardstand was full of boats. All of this was going on at the same time,  everyone managed to park and get access to the ramp including daytrippers in runabouts. What's changed? 

The Akarana has grown but use of the ramp has decreased if anything. So if the argument that the area is needed for recreational activities and carpark its a bit fallacious. What happens politically is once things get momentum, a whole raft of justifications become the conversation and direct the argument away from the core issues. People become invested in it, ego's start bouncing around etc. Some planner with no connection to the area, sport or its history gets excited about their project and pushes on regardless.

There is no doubt that the yachting public are stakeholders and need a voice with political representation throughout the consultation process. 

[Gladden Owner 2]

I think one of the other things we all need to think about with the possible loss of the hardstands at Okahu Bay, is that we all need to support the other club run hardstands. I know they are not good for mulithulls but haulage at Milford or Devonport are run by dedicated volunteers. Many of these volunteers are getting older, and without younger people becoming involved, these sites too could get developed.

So while it might be a faff to get organised, borrow a cradle and get in and pull your own boat out, if we don't do this now and support these places, when we are retired they simply won't be there.

If council does allow a hardstand or a seasonal hardstand at Okahu Bay, then maybe the priority should be given to mulitihulls who need the access the most ?

[ex Elly 197]

Okahu Bay Management Plan Hearing – 28 September, 2023

Janet Watkins attended the Okahu Bay Management Plan Hearing and this is her submission:

The Landing at Okahu Bay is a Regional asset that provides Coastal access to the Marine Environment for all Aucklanders and visitors.

https://www.ayba.org.nz/blog/post/111169/okahu-bay-management-plan-hearing--28-september-2023/?fbclid=IwAR3_S_gYTujLy2KwpMyqGtx-EejjsrWr8XZdq7wYOcj5n6VmrjK6NRLedKk

 

[motorb 26]

On 20/09/2023 at 7:26 PM, K4309 said:

Last chance to submit your feedback on the Landing Hardstand closing. Consultation closes this week.

It is an easy form to fill out.

The Landing Concept Plan (Pathways to the Sea) | AK Have Your Say (aucklandcouncil.govt.nz)

Ahhhh bugger I can't believe I missed that! Nothing on FB, no emails from various parties I've supported or interacted with, and only a 4 week window. What a shame.

[motorb 26]

On 19/09/2023 at 4:14 PM, Okahu Sailor said:

Ports of Auckland are struggling to hold onto their spot and they return millions to rate payers. Do you honestly believe a subsidised hardstand on prime, public, waterfront park land is going to last 5, 10, 15 years into future? Encourage the Council to allow club yards to expand their footprints, fundraise for better systems at these club yards, petition against zoning changes that allow property developers to build around marinas, and support the clubs that are doing what they need to survive.

 

Closing the ports is a developers wet dream and not in the interest of the wider city at all, which is pretty clear to everyone with half a brain. I'd hardly call that a good example of why we shouldn't be saving the hardstand.

Where do you get the idea the hardstand is subsidized? My understanding was that the council set the rates and could have increased them at any time, and that despite that it was a net profit on the books.

 

As for the rest of your post - much of the initial protest to the Orakei Board decision was precisely that a regional asset wasn't theirs to decide on, and that auckland needed a coherent marine plan to better manage these regional resources.

 

[otto 31]

OLBConsultationResults.pdf

Clear public support for a hardstand at The Landing 
Ōrākei Local Board asked for feedback on their decision to close the hardstand at The 
Landing and the response from ratepayers is NO. 
Results of the Ōrākei Local Board public consultaton on retenton of the hardstand at Okahu 
Bay shows a clear majority (64%) support retenton of a short stay haul out and hardstand 
facility for boat cleaning and/or ant-foul applicaton. 
There were 1,558 respondents of which 617 were Ōrākei residents. The response shows the 
hardstand is a regional issue and the Ōrākei Local Board does not have a mandate for 
closure. 

[Psyche 633]

Sounds promising

[Zozza 293]

I've never used Okahu Bay Hardstand....but living in Auckland most of my life,one of the highlights of driving or walking the Tamaki Drive was always going past and seeing the yachts in their cradles....it just adds something to that area

[harrytom 643]

On 11/05/2023 at 2:32 PM, otto said:

So far the AYBA has prevented the "mooring Dolphins" (or wharf) being placed in Ak harbour, Filling Rakino's Bays with moorings, Marine farms in the Firth, Marine Farming in the Bay of Islands.

No they havent prevent bugger all. Told you it was going ahead.

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/hauraki-gulf-kingfish-farm-clears-final-regulatory-hurdle